Misha Saul, a first-generation Jewish Australian and host of the Kvetch Substack, shares insights on the contrasts between Australia and the US, especially around their cultural identities and socio-economic structures. He discusses the surprising bureaucratic nature of Australia, its welfare state, and the urban lifestyle that defies outback stereotypes. The conversation dives into immigration complexities, Australia's unique fauna, and even lighthearted cultural debates like the love for Vegemite, illustrating the vibrant and nuanced fabric of Australian society.
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question_answer ANECDOTE
ANZAC and John Monash
Razib asks Misha to explain ANZAC, the Australian and New Zealand Army Corps.
Misha recounts the story of John Monash, a Jewish Australian general who led Allied troops to victory in WWI.
insights INSIGHT
Alternative Histories
Australia and other Anglo settler colonies represent alternative historical trajectories for British colonies.
Unlike America's revolutionary origins, Australia's history is rooted in convict settlements and a more gradual, bureaucratic development.
insights INSIGHT
Australian History and Demographics
Misha details Australia's history, starting as a British penal colony and evolving through different waves of immigration.
Key differences with the US include a homogenous British influence, a lack of rival colonial powers, and the absence of a history of slavery.
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On this episode of Unsupervised Learning Razib talks to Misha Saul, the host of the Kvetch Substack. Saul is a first-generation Jewish Australian, born in Georgia (former Soviet republic), who grew up in Adelaide and now lives in Sydney. He graduated from the University of Adelaide with degrees in commerce and law. His day job is in finance, but the Kvetch highlights his interests in history and Jewish culture.
Razib and Saul discuss extensively the differences and similarities between the US and Australia, and how each relates to other Anglophone nations like Canada, New Zealand and of course the UK. Saul asserts though Australia leans into its frontier reputation, in reality it is much more of a bureaucratic-ruled nation than the US, albeit with more of a Scots-Irish flavor than comparatively middle-class New Zealand. He also contrasts the relatively generous welfare-state of Australia and America’s inequality, which he describes by analogy to the film 2013 Elysium, with its contrast between an earth dominated by favelas and a well-manicured low-earth orbit utopia for the super rich. They also discuss the geographical and cultural coherency of a vast nation like Australia, which has a desert at its center. Saul mentions it is often actually cheaper to fly to and vacation in Bali or another Asian locale than going to Perth from Sydney. Despite the reality that Australia has exotic fauna, it is notably an overwhelmingly urban society, where few have any interaction with the “bush.” Though Australians appreciate archetypes like “Crocodile Dundee,” Saul paints a picture of a much more urbane reality. Razib asks about the phenomenon of “white-presenting” Aboriginals, and Saul argues all societies look somewhat crazy from the outside because of their shibboleths, and the debates around Aboriginality are Australia’s.
As an immigrant and first-generation Australian, Saul also discusses Australia’s immigration system, which strictly controls and regulates migration. Saul argues that because of the high educational and skill qualifications most Australian immigrants assimilate well, and he contends that there is a broad consensus to maintain strict limits on inflows. He argues that the Anglo-Australian identity is strong enough that the assimilative process continues to work even with the large number of Asians from China and India, who have triggered nativist worries and political activism.
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