What do DIY entrepreneurship, peak performance, and punk rock have in common? Everything.

In this live Flow Radio episode, recorded at Summit at Sea 2024, New York Times bestselling author and FRC Executive Director Steven Kotler joins fashion icon John Varvatos to trace the rebel spirit from CBGB’s to Silicon Valley. Together, they map how the kids nobody wanted—punks, misfits, and rule-breakers—accidentally built the culture of innovation we live in today.

This isn’t just music history. It’s a neuroscience-backed deep dive into how rebellion, risk, and raw self-expression create the perfect storm for flow—and why punk’s anti-authoritarian DNA became the blueprint for startup culture, action sports, and social movements.

If you’re chasing innovation, impact, or just trying to stay sane while breaking things—there’s flow on the other side of risk.

Go get it.

Guest Bio:

John Varvatos is an award-winning fashion designer, cultural curator, and lifelong rebel.Best known for fusing rock-and-roll attitude with high-end tailoring, he launched his namesake brand in 2000 and has since earned multiple CFDA Designer of the Year awards. He’s also the force behind the revival of CBGB—the legendary punk venue turned retail and cultural space.

From the Bowery to boardrooms, Varvatos has spent decades channeling the punk ethos into business, design, and live music. His work sits at the intersection of culture, entrepreneurship, and radical self-expression—making him not just a fashion icon, but a builder of movements.

In This Episode:

03:30 Punk as Evolutionary Instinct

06:45 The DIY Revolution Begins

10:55 The Neuroscience Behind the Movement

14:30 Group Flow, Mosh Pits & the End of the Stage Dive

18:15 From Subculture to Startup Culture

25:00 Punk Values: Radical Individuality to DIY Capitalism

30:45 Rebellion Goes Mainstream

36:00 The New Punk: Entrepreneurs, Artists & Conscious Rebels

38:20 Final Words from the Moshpit

Episode Resources:

Steven returns to Summit this June in Detroit—a city that pulses with creativity, reinvention, and raw energy.

Join a one-of-a-kind gathering of visionaries, builders, and creators. This one won’t be forgotten.

→ Learn more & apply to attend

Footage shot at Summit At Sea 2024, courtesy of Summit Series, © Summit Series.

Flow Radio Is Presented By Flow Research Collective

Flow Research Collective is a leading neuroscience research company. ‍

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Flow Research Collective was founded by Steven Kotler, one of the world’s leading experts on human peak performance. He is an award-winning journalist and author with over ten bestselling books.

Episode 213: LIVE from Maker Faire Bay Area!