John Anderson speaks with Lord Mervyn King about the shortcomings of modern economics, including its detachment from practical issues and over-reliance on modelling. They discuss the failures of economic forecasting during the COVID-19 pandemic and on climate change, stressing the importance of humility and honesty from policymakers. The discussion extends to socio-economic challenges like rising national debt and intergenerational inequality in Western democracies. The conversation also touches on modern monetary theory, quantitative easing, and the geopolitical implications of trade policies, especially with China. Lord King offers a critique of central bank digital currencies and cryptocurrencies, advocating against a completely cashless society.