🎙️ Apostles: Generals, Gardeners…or Something Else?

In this Bonus Conversation, Rob Wegner, Alan Hirsch, and Brian Johnson gather over pizza to explore why apostolic leadership has become a crossroads moment for the Church.

They unpack two radically different visions: apostles as empire-building generals vs. apostles as humble architects who cultivate Gospel ecosystems. From Alan’s personal stories (including being recruited by a secret dominionist cabal) to reflections on the Seven Mountains Mandate, this conversation names the tensions—and offers a better way forward.

Listen in as they discuss:

The dangers of power and platform without accountability
Why we need both Pauline (pioneering) and Petrine (remissionalizing) apostles
How dominion language drifts from the way of Jesus
Practical steps for living into decentralized, relational, generative leadership

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Horror on the Brain - Best of Coast to Coast AM - 9/18/25