What is xenising? And why do authority figures do it? Can we trace Farage back to the shamans of the past? Helen recommends Dr Manvir Singh's book Shamanism: The Timeless Religion, which helps inform a discussion around ritual and our desire for formality, and even otherness, from authority figures.

Helen and Armando also debate whether ayahuasca retreats are ego trips, or enlightening experiences, and why they could never follow Thatcher's night time regimen.

Join Helen and Armando over the summer for more cultural recommendations, available weekly on BBC Sounds.

Production Coordinator: Sarah Nicholls Executive Producer: Pete Strauss Sound Editing: Chris Maclean Recorded at The Sound Company

Strong Message Here: Strong Recommend is produced by Gwyn Rhys Davies and is a BBC Studios production for Radio 4.

Inter:views 31 | Roxana Nasoi | Strategic Advocate | Romania