“There are vital truths there that people need to know about. And if in my role as an educator, I can point people in the direction of finding that stuff out. I'm very pleased.” In this archival episode, host, Mark revisits a conversation he had with psychologist, educator, intrepid consciousness explorer and researcher Dr. Charles Tart in 1993. Dr. Tart highlights the differences between science and scientism, expressing how you can test your beliefs and understand how the world works. “I'm proud to consider myself both a very tough-minded scientist and a spiritual seeker." Dr. Tart presents that while we may not find a single unifying Truth, “we can have fewer falsehoods, we can have fewer delusions… we can learn about the ways in which we fool ourselves... [for] a greater opportunity to learn what's really going on with ourselves, with our spirits, with our minds, with our worlds, that is something we can definitely make progress along. …I'm a long, long way from being enlightened, whatever that means. But I'm not as badly deluded as I used to be 20 years ago”. As Mark shares “If this is the first time you've ever heard of Dr. Charles Tart, I hope this interview inspires you to learn a lot more because there's a lot more to learn”.