The Private School Leader Podcast Episode 129: Does Your Spouse/Partner/Best Friend Have "Listening Fatigue?”
For 33 years, I did the same thing almost every day. I came home from school and immediately started venting to my wife about my day as a private school leader.
I am ashamed to say, it wasn’t until after I retired, that I stopped to think about how doing that every day made my wife feel. All those years of me venting and complaining and all those years of her listening and trying to make me feel better.
Recently, I asked my wife, “What impact did all of that have on you?” Here’s what she said”
- “Most of the time, it was really hard.”
- “Usually, I absorbed your stress.”
- “I was frustrated because I couldn’t fix it.”
- “It felt like your day was more important than my day.”
I would like to say that this conversation was a “wake-up call” for me, but it really wasn’t. That’s because I recently retired and now I’m usually not stressed out at the end of a day of coaching clients or recording podcast episodes.
I’m not saying that this is what you are doing every day. I am saying that it is something that we need to talk about. On today’s episode of The Private School Leader Podcast, we are going to answer the question: Does Your Spouse/Partner/Best Friend Have "Listening Fatigue?”
Thank you for taking me along with you when you are walking the dog, driving to school or running errands. I appreciate you and what you are doing for the lucky kids and teachers at your school. Thanks so much for listening and thanks for making a difference!
Mark Minkus
I am super excited about a brand new resource that I want to share with you for FREE! It is a 45 minute Masterclass called: “Winning At School Without Losing At Home”. This is a video webinar training complete with guided notes and it will do exactly what the title says. This training will help you to be successful, organized and energized at school while still taking good care of yourself AND your family! Does that sound too good to be true? Go to theprivateschoolleader.com/winning to grab your free Masterclass training Winning At School Without Losing At Home”.
Are any of these statements true about you?
- The "tyranny of the urgent" controls my day, and I start working on my important tasks when the school gets quiet.
- I feel discouraged, lonely, exhausted and stressed out. I'm not sure that my job is sustainable.
- My school invades every part of my professional and personal life.
- I want to have a long and happy and fulfilling career as a private school leader.
- I feel called to do this work, but I am not sure how long I can keep doing it if nothing changes.
I have felt that way many times during my career. That’s why I created the PSL Pro Membership
PSL Pro is a membership community that helps Private School Leaders go from feeling stressed out, discouraged and lonely to feeling energized, fulfilled and supported.
You will have access to a thriving community of school leaders who actually "get it" and "get you"! We will go live every month for a Masterclass, a Success Path Coaching Session, two "We Get It" Roundtable Sessions and a live Q&A about anything and everything related to Private School Leadership.
The PSL Pro Success Path is a Step by Step Plan to get you from where you are to where you want to be as a leader. Different Levels: The Overwhelmed Drifter, The Intentional Architect, all the way to The Fulfilled Mentor. After you choose your level, you will be guided, step-by-step, through the content in THRIVE Academy. This content, along with my guidance and the support of other leaders, will take you from where you are all the way to being The Fulfilled Mentor!
Learn more about how you can join the PSL Pro community by going to www.theprivateschoolleader.com/membership
Is it just me or are the parents at our schools getting more demanding and more intense, more often? Dealing with parents is part of the job as we lead our private schools, but it can quickly lead to stress, anxiety and feeling overwhelmed.
That’s why I created Parent Academy! Now you have a step by step framework that will help you go from feeling stressed and anxious to feeling confident and calm. Over the last 33 years, I have built successful relationships with thousands of parents and I have packaged that knowledge into an online course. Not only that, but after I teach you, I am going to teach your teachers these strategies as well! Parent Academy contains two, 45-minute webinars that are Teacher PD’s with a printable notebook, guided notes and discussion questions. Go to www.theprivateschoolleader.com/parentacademy to learn more!
What is your biggest problem right now? I want to hear more about your biggest problem and I want to help you solve it.
Whether your problem is feeling guilty that your family gets what’s left of you at the end of the day, relentless parents, difficult teachers, a lack of boundaries between work and school, feeling overwhelmed, Imposter Syndrome, enrollment or teacher morale, I can help.
I would love to hear more about your biggest problem and I would love to be your coach. Go to www.theprivateschoolleader.com/coaching to learn more about working with me 1-on-1.
Being a private school leader is a VERY difficult job. You have to make hundreds of decisions every day, and you have to keep everyone safe, increase enrollment, keep the parents happy, keep the board happy, motivate the teachers, deal with student discipline, beat last year’s test scores and come in under budget.
That can lead to you feeling tired, discouraged and stressed out. I’ve been there. That’s why I created THRIVE Academy just for you. THRIVE Academy is a digital course that will help you get out of survival mode and get back to feeling energized at school. To learn more, go to www.theprivateschoolleader.com/thrive
I am excited to share with you a new resource and I want to give this to you as a FREE GIFT to say “thank you” for listening to the podcast. It is called The 7 Secrets To Improving Teacher Morale. As private school leaders, we are always looking for ways to improve teacher morale at our schools, but it is hard to know where to start. Well, now you have a step by step plan and you can grab it at theprivateschoolleader.com/morale
I want to give you a FREE gift called 7 Strategies To Effectively Deal With Difficult Teachers. Sometimes we need some courage and confidence to deal with difficult teachers. What you need is a plan! This guide is a step by step plan that you can use to help one of your difficult teachers improve their performance and improve their attitude. Go to theprivateschoolleader.com/difficult to grab this free guide!
I’ve created a free resource for you called “The 6 Things That Every Private School Teacher Wants From Their Leader”. This guide is a 6 page pdf that will be a game changer for you. I guarantee you that if you do these 6 things, the teachers at your school will be happy to follow you. You can pick up your free guide by going to www.theprivateschoolleader.com/guide
I want to give you a gift to say “thank you” for listening to the podcast. I have created a FREE guide for you called “5 Strategies To Help You Work With Difficult Parents”. We know that working with parents is part of the job and most of our parents are great, but some of them can be very demanding and emotional and difficult. This guide will give you the tools that you need to build better relationships and have better meetings with the difficult parents at your school. Go to www.theprivateschoolleader.com/parents to grab the guide. Thank you again for listening every week!
Please check out all of the free resources on my website that can help you serve and lead your school community. There are "Plug & Play PD's" (45 minute webinars with guided notes) as well as Top 10 Lists of Leadership Books, Productivity Books and TED Talks over at www.theprivateschoolleader.com/resources. You can grab the show notes for today's episode at www.theprivateschoolleader.com/episode129
Please write a review of this podcast and help the algorithm push this content out to more leaders. I would love to get your feedback about the podcast, ideas for future episodes and hear about how you are implementing these strategies in your life and at your school. You can email me at mark.o.minkus@gmail.com Thanks!!
I’ve created a FREE RESOURCE for you called “The Top 6 Ways To Protect Your School From a Lawsuit”. This is a 10 page pdf that will help you to keep your staff and students safe and help keep your school out of court. Litigation is expensive, time consuming and extremely stressful. This common sense guide will help you to be more intentional and proactive when it comes to protecting your school. You can grab “The Top 6 Ways To Protect Your School From a Lawsuit” at www.theprivateschoolleader.com/lawsuit. Thanks!
I want to say thank you for listening to the podcast by giving you a FREE GIFT. It is called The 7 Steps To Having Successful Meetings With Upset Parents. This guide is an 11 page pdf that gives you a step by step plan to have better meetings with the parents at your school. Every good coach has a game plan. Every good teacher has a lesson plan. Too many private school leaders don’t have a plan when they sit down to meet with an upset parent. Well, now you have a PLAN! You can grab this FREE GUIDE at www.theprivateschoolleader.com/meeting
I am excited to share a brand new resource with you. It is a 9 page pdf called: “How To Use Verbal Judo To Have Better Conversations With The Parents At Your School” What is “Verbal Judo”? "Verbal Judo" is a communication strategy that focuses on using words effectively to de-escalate conflict, resolve disputes, and achieve positive outcomes in various interpersonal interactions, particularly in high-pressure situations.
George Thompson and Jerry Jenkins wrote a book called Verbal Judo: The Gentle Art Of Persuasion. So, I have taken several important strategies from the book and applied them to your life as a private school leader. Grab your free copy of “How To Use Verbal Judo To Have Better Conversations With The Parents At Your School” at www.theprivateschoolleader.com/judo
TRANSCRIPT:
• I strongly believe that it is possible to have a long and happy and fulfilling career as a private school leader. And my passion is to help you figure out exactly how to do just that right here on the Private School Leader podcast. And I'm your host, Mark Minkus. • • • So for all 33 years of my career as a private school leader, • • most days when I would come home from school, • I would do the same thing. • • • • And • • what that was • • • • would be that I would just. • • I'd say hi to my wife, I'd say hi to my kids, • • • and I would vent to my wife about my day. • • And sometimes it wouldn't be a vent session. It would be that I would tell her about my day. And some, you know, sometimes I'd mix in the good things that happened. But let's face it, you know, when you hit the door at the end of the day and you're tired and you're stressed, • • • that • I'll admit, as I look back over my career, that most of the time it was, can you believe • • • that this parent had this crazy request? Or can you believe that this parent gave me my to do list today? That's so. I can't believe it. I'm so frustrated. Or I can't believe that these two teachers can't get along, or I can't believe that this teacher did this or • • about these. This student that did this thing. And so I would talk about my day. • • • • But I think that as I look back on it now, • • • uh, a lot of it wasn't just talking about my day, but a lot of it was venting my frustration as I talked about my day. • • • And recently I asked my wife • • • • about it. I will honestly say, and I'm ashamed to say that for 33 years, • • • I never asked her this question. • But just recently, I asked my wife, well, • • what impact did that have on you? You know, all of those days, for all of Those years, for 33 years of me coming home and telling you about my day or venting about my day, what impact did that have on you? • • And she said a couple of things. She said, well, • • • • some days it was really hard, • um, because I absorbed your stress. • • • • And • • I was also really frustrated because I love you and I couldn't fix it. • • • • And she said sometimes it would make me feel bad because it always seemed like your day at school was more important than my day. • • • • • • • • And I can't even say to you today that that was a wake up call for me • • • because, • • you know that I recently retired • • • • and, • • • • uh, you know, a wake up call implies that you're going to change your behavior. I can't. I don't have a time machine. I can't go back • • and ask her the question • • • • 10 years into my 33 year career and say, hey, you know, let's talk about this. Like, what impact is this having on you? I never asked her that question. • • • • So I can't say it's a wake up call because • • • • • I've retired and now I'm doing this full time with the podcast and with coaching and with the online courses and the membership. • • • • And so now I just am thinking about, okay, • • • • what can I do • • • to • help • • • • other • school leaders • when it comes to • • the person that they vent to, talked to • • • transfer their stress from them to that person? What can I do • to take at least this experience that I've had and that my wife has had • • • and try to help? And so on today's episode of the Private School Leader podcast, • we are going to answer • this question. • •
I'm excited about a new resource called Winning at School Without Losing Home
Does your spouse, partner, best friend • • have listening fatigue? • • • • • • And so I'm super excited about a brand new resource and I want to share it with you before we jump • • into today's topic. • • And this is a 45 minute masterclass called Winning at School Without Losing at Home. • So I want you to listen to that title again. Winning at School Without Losing at Home. Is that something that you want to do? Well, this is a video webinar training and it has guided notes and it will do exactly what the title says. • • It will help you be successful, organized, energized and fulfilled at school • while still taking good care of yourself and your family and your loved ones. And I know that might sound too good to be true, but I would encourage you to go to the privatescchooler.com winning • • and grab your free masterclass training called Winning at School Without Losing at Home. And I think it can be a real game changer for you. And that is free for you@the • privatescchooliter.com • winning. • • • • And then I wanted to remind you that Parent Academy has two plug and play PDs, 45 minute webinars for your teachers. • And after I teach you everything that I've learned in my career about how to effectively work with parents and to keep the 5% of parents that are trying to ruin your school to keep them from living rent free in your head and keep them from ruining your school, after I teach you those concepts and principles and strategies, then I teach your teachers in these video webinars. • • And so there have been some private schools in North Carolina, Texas, Ohio, California, that have already used these plug and play PDs. And I just want to give you a couple quotes from the teachers who've • • participated in these trainings. • • This is a paradigm shift for our school. • • • • Customers versus clients changed how I see my job. • • • • • I never thought a PD could be relevant to all three divisions in our school. We all have the same issues with parents whether we teach the 3 year old or the 12th grader. Private schools are different. This PDU is relevant to us from beginning to end. • • • Two more I learned that the reason why parents may come off as defensive or have strong opinions about their child's experience in class is because they have fears, they have hopes for their child. • • Not having any children myself, this perspective opened my mind and heart and helped me send some very important emails in the afternoon • after the pd. • • And then finally quot • • • • • I have been in education for 30 years and this is the best PD I've ever had. • • So with Parent Academy, you and your teachers will go from feeling anxious, stressed • • and stressed about working with parents to feeling confident, calm and relaxed. • • And I'll teach you the framework and then I'll teach your teachers. And so just head over to parent to, uh, the Privatechoolade leader.com parentacademy to learn more. I'd love to get this into your hands. • You can use Title II funds to pay for this. Most of my, um, most of the people who've purchased Parent Academy so far have used Title II funds. • • Learn more about Parent academy@the privatescchooladeer.com • • parent academy. • • •
Do your spouse or partner or best friend have listening fatigue?
All right, so today's topic. • • Does your spouse or partner or best friend have listening fatigue? And so what we're going to do is define listening fatigue. It's also called empathy fatigue. • Then we're I'm going to give you the four signs • • that your loved one • might be suffering from listening fatigue. • And then five ways that listening fatigue can negatively impact that relationship. • • • • And then seven strategies for improving the current situation. • • • • And I always encourage you to listen to the podcast while you're driving to school or walking the dog or working out or running errands. And so I know that I just said four signs of this and five ways to do this and seven strategies. • As usual, I will take good care of you in the show notes • and you can get those@the privateschooler.com Episode 129 and all of that will be there for you. So just listen and then you can go back if you want to take another look at these strategies. • • So first of all, what is listening fatigue? Which is also known as empathy fatigue. • Well, listening fatigue is the emotional exhaustion • • and mental drain that happens when someone constantly listens • to someone else's emotional struggles, their frustrations, their complaints. • • • And this happens when • • the person listening • • doesn't receive adequate support or relief for themselves. • • So let's take this out of the context for just a moment • • of • • • you and your spouse or partner or your best friend. And let's talk about for just a second, listening fatigue from the standpoint of like a therapist, • • • • um, or perhaps a caregiver who is, let's say caring for an elderly person. And all that elderly person does is like complain because they're in pain all the time and of course they're going to complain. So let's just take it out of the context of a private school leader coming home INV vening to • • uh, your spouse or partner. • • • • • If you think about it, you know, therapists, there's research to show that um, • • a lot of therapists, especially during COVID and right after Covid, we're dealing with the empathy fatigue and the uh, listening fatigue and that emotional exhaustion. • And this happens with caregivers as well. And so it'again it's a mental drain • that occurs for the listener • • when they're listening, listening, listening about someone else's struggles and frustrations and complaints. But the listener isn't receiving enough support or relief themselves. • • • • • • • And it's different from feeling generally tired after a conversation. So for example, if you're an introvert, typically • • • conversations, social situations might kind of wear you out a little bit. So this goes deeper because it's actually, • • • like I said, emotional exhaustion that happens over time. • • • And you know, when one person is always in the role of the listener • • but rarely gets to share their own feelings or frustrations in return. And again, I have to bow my head in shame here as I think about • • my career as a private school leader and think about what was I • the person who was • • • sharing my feelings and frustrations and my wife was the role played the role of the listener, like all the time. And the answer is yes, • that's what happened with us. • • And so this is a little bit of a snapshot of what listening fatigue, • empathy fatigue • is how we can define it. • • And you know, there's research out there now that is starting to • um, show that • • • the long term impact of this on the listener can be • • burnout, emotional overload, um, • • feelings of resentment, • • um, and that if there's not proper self care. This is more research that's from the um, long term elder care, • • • uh, community • of research, • • um, Just the emotional toll on the listener. • And you know, again, I talked about long term. We know that burnout is the end state of long term stress. • Well, maybe it's not that person's stress. Maybe it's that they're receiving stress from the person that they're listening to. And so the last thing I'll say on that • • • • • is that I would always feel better when I talk to my wife. • • But I remember • a, uh, few years ago that • • I realized that really what I was doing was doing like a stress transplant. I was taking the stress out of my body and I was doing a transplant into her body. • • And • • • I guess I didn't realize it at the time. • • I'm realizing it now. • • And of course I can do things now to repair our relationship about that. Fortunately, our relationship is very strong and it survived that because she's very strong. But • for those of you that are private school leaders and have someone at home that when you come home, you vent to, I just want to make sure that you're aware of all of these things. • • •
Listening fatigue is when your partner gives short or non engaged responses
So then let's pivot to what are five signs • • that my • • spe, or excuse me, four signs that my spouse or partner or best friend is suffering from? Listen. Listening fatigue. So what are some signs of listening fatigue? Number one, shortened or non engaged responses. • • So if, if your, uh, partner, your spouse is no longer • offering some thoughtful empathic responses and is giving you like the quick, uh, uh-huh. Huh. Okay. All right. • • • • It could be a sign that they've kind of checked out emotionally, and especially if you have something to compare it to. So for example, • • • • • if a couple years ago, • • when you would vent and you would come home and you would talk about the stress of your day • and the length of the responses was different, • the level of engagement and involvement was different, and now it just seems kind of distant and short and, • • um, non engaged, • then that could be a sign of, um, listening fatigue. • • And remember, I'm giving you the bad news first, and then I'm going to give you the strategies at the end. So don't get overwhelmed or feel shame and guilt • about where you are. • • Adding a lot of shame and guilt to this situation right now isn't really going to help the situation. I guess it'll help a little bit if it moves you to take action. But we're not going to • • wallow or just bathe ourselves in shame and guilt about, • • um, if we realize, oh, no, you know, this has been happening for years. • • Okay, like I said before, I don't have a time machine. You don't have a time machine. What we can control is our behavior in this moment and moving forward. Okay, I'll get off my soapbox about that, about our self talk, but okay.
Another sign that your partner might be suffering from listening fatigue or empathy fatigue is irritability
Another sign that your, uh, partner might be suffering from • • • listening fatigue or empathy fatigue is irritability or frustration. • • So if the listener starts showing a lot of frustration or irritability when you're sharing your stress from school, from your day, then that could be a sign that they're feeling overwhelmed. • And they also could, could like snap at you or respond with a lot of impatience • • • because they're just kind of struggling to keep up with the emotional load. Because here's the thing, and again, I can only share my experience, • • • • but • • • when our kids were at home, when my wife, • uh, was a stay at home mom, • um, you know, there's a lot that's going on there that's just from a physical fatigue, from an emotional load, from a cognitive load, just caring for the children, um, all throughout our marriage, different seasons, • • um, different, uh, amount of a load at the end of the day. And then I was adding to that load. And so if they're struggling, • • your spouse, • • • um, • you know, your best friend, maybe it's your sister, maybe it's your mom, whoever is that person that's the listener, • • • • • they might start to become irritable and frustrated. And then number three, these are the signs that this might be happening. Number three is lack of active participation. So maybe again, this is comparing the past to the present. Maybe they would have chimed in with advice or shared their own feelings, but now they just seem kind of like, • you know, emotionally drained and they can't really engage in being a support to you • because • • they just can't do it anymore or can't do it as frequently. • • And so number three is lack of active participation. And then number four is kind of a combo. It's frequent distractions, • lack of eye contact and physical distance. So if the person that you're talking to, that you're venting to, if they're distracting themselves during your conversation, they're scrolling on their phone, they're kind of zoning out, • they keep redirecting the conversation. • • • • Um, again, this could be a sign that they're just avoiding. • • • They want this to be over, they're avoiding that, getting emotionally involved because of the price that they're paying to get emotionally involved in your stuff. • • And then, like I said, avoiding eye contact • • and then sometimes even moving physically farther away on the couch or, • um, what have you. • • And those could all be signs. So I'm not saying that if that's happening, that this is why. But again, there's a combination of factors, and so it's just something to get on your radar. • •
Emotional distance can lead to listening fatigue, empathy fatigue
So then I want to talk real quickly about five, • • um, things that could impact how this could negatively impact the relationship if listening fatigue, empathy fatigue is actually happening. • • • • So the first is, number one is emotional distance. • • So we want to be emotionally close • to our, ah, loved ones. • • But over time, • • • the person that'your. That's the listener, • • • • they may start to emotionally withdraw from you • • because of all the stress you're bringing through the door when you come home from a bad day at school. • • • And so what used to be, uh, a compassionate ear • might just become • a silent listener, • • • • um, • • • or a disinterested listener. And • • here's the problem that this distance, this emotional distance • • • • • • • can cause erosion. • • The connection that you have with your wife or with your partner or • • • with your husband, • • with your best friend, with your sister, with your mom, whoever it is that you're talking to. • • • • • And it can make the other conversations harder. So if there's emotional distance that grows between the two of you, then the other conversations about life and raising a family and financial decisions can be more difficult because of this thing that's going on between you. • • Now, I want to pause here again and remind you. I don't think I can remind you often enough. We're not going to attachh guilt or shame to this. I'm not saying that everybody has this. Some of you, when you come home, you don't talk about school ever. Okay, well, I hope that you're talking to somebody. • • Um, but we have to find that happy medium. We have to find that balance. We have to make sure that our partner is, um, in a good space to hear what we have to say. And we'll talk about that during the strategies. But I just felt like I needed to pause again and remind you. We're not going to • • just proceed with doom and gloom and then press • • stop or press pause. We're going to hear some hard truth and then we're going to take action. • • Okay, once again, I'll get off my soapbox. •
Second thing about how this can impact the relationship is resentment
Um, the second thing about how this can impact the relationship is resentment. And so if your spouse is constantly hearing about your day at school • • and then is hearing all that, you know, taking on all that emotional weight of your complaining and vening • • and your frustration, • • they may start to resent the fact that when you come home, this is the first thing that you do. • • • And we know what it's like when we are feeling resentment towards someone or towards our school or towards our boss or towards a parent or whatever. • • And • • resentment can build up over time. • • And this is true with your • • spouse or partner, especially if they feel like they're not, their needs are not being met. • • Okay, number three is burnout. And this one kind of speaks for itself just like anything else that if there's just constant, • • • • • um, absorption of that, those emotions • • • and you know, there's not self care to • • um, balance that out, • • • • that can lead to burnout. The end state of cumulative stress is burnout and can leave your • spouse or partner feeling drained. And then like I said before, they're less available for other conversations in your life, in your relationship. • Um, number four is loss of empathy, • um, over a long period of time of listening and giving empathy. But if, • • • if they're not being heard, if they're not given the same opportunity to share about their day, that they might become less empathic, • • um, and might start to tune out. Um, and so that can cause some disconnection in the relationship. And then number five is unmet emotional needs. • • And so, • • • • you know, again, listening fatigue or empathy fatigue, • • um, • you know, often results in one of the partner's emotional needs being met and one partner, their needs going unmet. • • • Um, and listen, I'll just speak again for myself. I know that • • • when I came home, • • • um, I had all of this stuff built up inside of me because • can't. I'm not going to talk to my teachers about it. I'm not going to talk to, you know, my board president about it or whatever. • • I'm going toa like keep it in and then I'm going toa just come through the back door and as soon as I see my wife, I'm gonna, or at least I did, • um, kind of just let it out because it needs to go somewhere. • • Um, sometimes I would just push it down and put a lid on that box. But that's not the best thing for the future either. Um, • but you know, again, it can cause that, • • • um, distance if they feel • like they're not able to express their own feelings or frustration and just might feel unsupported and • • • • can impact the relationship that way. So again, that's the bad news. Um, but I want to give you good news and that is that we can take action and we can do some things we can plant, um, you know, put a stake in the ground today and say • that this relationship is important to me and that, you know, and I'm also not saying that you can't vent. I mean, I think it's important to talk about your day at school and your frustrations and your stress. But there's a different way of thinking about it, and there's a different way of doing it.
Number one is talk about it. Number one is going to sound pretty obvious
And, um, now we're going to get into the seven strategies for improving whatever your current situation is. Okay. Number one is going to sound pretty obvious, but it's actually by far the most important one. Number one is talk about it. • • So, for example, just imagine you saying • to your. • • • Your spouse, your partner, your best friend, your sister, your mom, whoever it is that is the listener in this relationship. • • • • • • • You just say, hey, um, um, I know that I vent a lot, and I know that I talked about school a lot, and • • I love you and I value our relationship. And I don't want to just come home every day and transfer all of my stress from my body into your body. And I want you to be okay. • • And I just wanted to talk about this. Is it okay if we talk about this? Um, • • you know, and how does it make you feel when I vent about frustrations at school? • • • • I never asked that question once in the 33 years that I was a private school leader. Don't be like me, okay? • • Um, you know, do you. And then a question could be, do you. Do you feel like I care about what happens during your day? • • You know, we want things to be proportional. • • • And maybe your partner, your spouse doesn't want to really talk about their day. You know, it could be that you're. You know, there's a lot of opposites attract in our relationships, and sometimes the person who becomes the school leader, • • • um, • • they are the one who, you know, uses a lot of words during the day, you know, and the other partner, • the other, um, person in the relationship, they're a person. A few words, okay? It also might be that you used up all your words during the day, and the last thing you want to do when you get home is talk about your school day. Okay? But everybody's different. And I just know that there's a lot of people listening to this episode who are probably headed towards, • • • um, a continuing of a career where • you're kind of following the path that I followed, • • which was a big imbalance in • • • the sharing versus the asking and listening. So number one is just talk about it, have a conversation about it, and really listen. • • Number two, • • strategy is to set boundaries on emotional conversations. • • • And this isn't a bad idea with, you know, other kinds of conversations. But with this, • • for example, specifically, • • • • • we're going to talk about how long and then when and where. So when you're setting boundaries, how Long. Well, you know what, it can really help if you, it can help you and your spouse • or your partner if • • you • set a time limit. • • So say after you come home and say hello and you know, kind of change clothes or whatever it is, that for 15 minutes you're going to talk about your day. All right. • • This will help the listener tremendously if this is something that you start to do, because they can tune in for 15 minutes and you can probably get most of the stress out in 15 minutes. And if not, we need to get better at getting, • • um, • more concise about sharing out about our day. But if there's no time limit and there's no end in sight, and there's been other times where we've talked for a really long time, then the listener is just like, o, • • you know, how long is this going to go on? But that's something that has been really, really helpful to um, some, that, you know, some of the research that I did, um, some of the, um, • • you know, clients that I work with, just to set a timer and you don't have to have an egg timer, you know, sitting there. You can just kind of keep an eye on the clock or whatever. But how long are you going to talk about it and then when and where? • Let, let's set some boundaries. We're going to keep it out of the bedroom. • • Um, we're not going to do it at the dinner table. We're not going to do it right before bed. We're not going to do it in front of the kids. • • So think about boundaries • • and think about how long and think about when and where. • • And then number three strategy is ask first. • • So for example, what I did was I would come home. I never asked my wife, hey, um, • • • are you doing okay? Can I share a little bit about my day? I never asked her that question one time. • • • Um, but before you dive in, • • maybe just ask, hey, are you in a good space to listen right now for 15 minutes? If I could just talk to you about my day. It gives them the opportunity to say, you know what, • I'm exhausted. What if we talked in a couple of hours after dinner? Or, you know, but if we just start and we just, you know, start with, uh, • • the day. You're never going to believe this. Okay, I get it. • • • But • • it shows so much respect • • • to your spouse • • if • • your, to your partner, to your best friend. If you ask the question, • • are you, are you good to listen for a few minutes? • • • • Ah, you're prioritizing their emotional well being. So number three is ask first. Number Four is reciprocate. • • So make sure • • • that all the listening • • to the venting • • is reciprocal, • • because you're the person that you love, that listener. • • • • • They have stuff too, • • • and we need to be just as present. It's their turn when it's our turn to listen. And I'll be honest, I wasn't good at that either. • • You know, I would feel better because I had just, like, transferred all this stress from my body to my wife's body. But then when it was my turn to listen to her day, I just have to be honest, I wasn't always tuned in because I was tuned in all day long. • • • And then I did a little bit of an adrenaline dump or got some cortisol out of my body or whatever when I talked to her. And now I'm feeling more chill and more relaxed. And then I'm not really tuned in as an empathic, active listener. But it has to be • • reciprocal, • • because • • • • the only thing worse • • than just • • venting • • • • • and not really • • caring • about, you know, how that person is receiving all that, the only thing worse than that is probably venting and then tuning out when they talk about their day. • • So number four is reciprocate. Number five on our seven strategies • • • • is to share something positive. We have a negativity bias in our brain, and that is to help keep us safe and that we're constantly assessing threats with our fight or flight response. And so it is so much easier to remember the negative things in our day than the positive. • • • But most days, not every day, but most days, there's at least one positive thing that happened at school. And sometimes we need to think really hard about what that was. • • • But if the only things that we ever share are the negatives, • • • man, • • • • • • • • • • think about it this way. Flip it around. If you had a friend who every time you saw them, the only thing that they did was vent to you and complain • • about their day. Let's pretend for a minute • • that this friend isn't in, • • • you know, private schools, but they're in, like, the corporate world. And this is the main interactions that you have when you see that friend, you're probably not going to want to hang out with them very long, okay? • • And so we can share something positive, and then we also need to be positive. • • • • Um, give our partner express gratitude for them listening. • • • • • I don't know how many times, probably not very many. I'm ashamed to say that when I was done with my little event session, that I thanked my wife for listening. I'm sure I probably did it some of the time, but I didn't do it, like, all the time. • • • • • I just really thank you so much for listening. I feel so much better. Thank you. It takes, like, three seconds to say that, but • • I don't know. • • I don't know if I ever said that, honestly. • •
Number six is prioritize downtime together. And it benefits your partner, too, your spouse
All right, and then our final two strategies. Number six is prioritize downtime together. • Um, • you know, I really like the no work talk aloud. Nwta, you know, that there could be times • • just a section of your evening or a section of your weekend where there's no work talk allowed. And it benefits your partner, too, your spouse, so • • • • • • they have a stressful job, regardless of what they're doing for work. You have a stressful job, • and it's important for you to both • • • • empathize and listen • • and, uh, support • • because of what they're sharing. But also there's value in having set times where you're not going to talk about work. • • • And so, you know, again, it's about quality time and relaxing and bonding • • • • as a couple in this relationship or as a, you know, maybe it's not, um, a married couple or a partnership. Maybe it's a friendship or siblings, but. Or a parent child, if you're close to one of your parents. But whatever it is, • • • • you can prioritize the time that you spend together where you enjoy that person's company, where it doesn't involve talking about your school. • • And then number seven is to take care of your mental health. Here's the thing. • • • If I paused and stopped and thought about the fact that, you know, if someone objectively was like a fly on the wall and didn't know much about me other than what I said when I came home from work, they would probably be like, it sounds like you need to find a different job, you know, • and so I'm not telling you that you need to get to, you know, find a different school or to get out of private school education. The whole point of this podcast is to help you do this and do it well and not be in survival mode, and to thrive and to feel, • um, supported and to feel, • um, fulfilled. And all of that is a pursuit. And we do that together here every single week. • • But if you're finding that you're constantly overwhelmed at work, you might need to talk to somebody. And I know that it's helped me tremendously • • to talk to a therapist, • • um, you know, at different points in my career, had a therapist • • • have, um, a therapist right now. And so I'm not saying that that's what you need. I'm saying that if you assess • • and you find out that this is a big thing and it's a prolonged thing and it's really impacting your relationships that maybe that's something that you want to consider.
What is listening fatigue or empathy fatigue?
Okay, so let's review what we've just talked about. What is listening fatigue or empathy fatigue? It's the emotional exhaustion and mental drain that happens when the listener • is, • you know, listening to the emotional struggles and frustrations and the complaints, but they're not receiving support or reciprocation themselves. So it's a long term • • impact of it being one sided. • • What are four signs that my spouse or partner or best friend is suffering from listening fatigue? Number one, shortened or non engaged responses. Two is irritability or frustration. • Three, lack of active participation and four, frequent distractions, • lack of eye contact or physical distance. • • • • What are five • • • ways that listening fatigue can negatively impact my relationship? Number one, emotional distance, two, resentment. Three, burnout. Four, loss of empathy and five, unmet emotional needs. • And then what are seven strategies for improving the current situation? • • • • Number one, talk about it. Number two, set boundaries on emotional conversations such as how long and when and where. • • Number three, ask first. Four is reciprocate. Five, share something positive. Six, prioritize downtime together. And number seven is take care of your mental health. • • And I always like to wrap up every episode with a call to action. • • And the call to action is to have a conversation • • • when you, • • um, you know, when you are done listening to this podcast or later this week is to just have a conversation • • • • • • with your partner, your spouse, your best friend. • • So I want to give you a tool that can help with all of this. • Um, because the title of this, • • • uh, free resource that I want to give you is called Winning at School Without Losing at Home. • And I mentioned it at the top, but you know, if you ever feel like you have nothing left at the end of the day and then you feel guilty about that and you know, our jobs as private school leaders are exhausting and emotionally draining. I want to help you • and I've created a free 45 minute masterclass with guided notes. It's a video. You can watch it, you can listen to it just like you do this podcast. It's called Winning at School Without Losing at Home. • • • I'm, um, giving you a plan • and it's yours for free over at the privatesckaleade. Leader.com Winning again. That's your free masterclass called • Winning at School Without Losing at home@the privatescchoolutr.com winning. And then just one final reminder that, you know, sometimes it seems like the parents at our schools are getting more demanding, more intense, more often, and that this is becoming a bigger and bigger part of our job, and a more and more stressful part of our job is dealing with the parents at our school. • And so I've taken everything that I've learned over my career about how to successfully work with parents and put it into a digital online course called Parent Academy. And after I teach you these strategies, • then I'll teach your teachers, and you can check that out@the privatescchoolia.com • • parentacademy and I'd like to ask you to do a favor for me, and that is to just please share the link to this podcast with another leader or a rising leader at your school. • • Um, I can't tell you. It's weekly that I hear that. You know, the way I found this podcast was someone shared this link with me. There are lots of people out there that are, um, that need this content, that are suffering, that are frustrated, that are feeling really lonely and isolated. So just please share the link to the podcast with another leader in your life. And I told you I'd take good care of you in the show notes, and those are at www.the privateschooleader.com/episode 129. • • And, you know, I just really, really appreciate you, all of your hard work, all of the things that you do for those lucky kids and lucky teachers at your school. And I appreciate you taking some of your precious time out of your week to join me here today. • And I will see you next time right here on the Private School Leader podcast. And until then, always remember to serve first, lead second, and make a difference.