Tangle Suspension of the rules. - Isaac, Ari and Kmele chat about law enforcement encounters, Kanye West and then Isaac interviews Elliot Williams about his new book Five Bullets.
Jan 30, 2026
Elliot Williams, journalist and author of Five Bullets, explores Bernard Goetz and the 1984 subway shooting. The conversation covers law enforcement encounters and practical de-escalation tips. They also compare historical cases to modern incidents and discuss how media and advocacy groups shaped public reaction.
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Officer Conduct Drives Outcomes
- Police behavior matters more than civilian provocation because officers hold the power to escalate or deescalate.
- Focusing public scrutiny on agent decisions is crucial when evaluating violent outcomes.
Deescalate By Being Predictable
- If you interact with law enforcement, prioritize predictability: show your hands, avoid sudden movements, and follow simple commands.
- Record the encounter if you feel unsafe and avoid arguing at the scene to reduce escalation risks.
Document Later, Comply Now
- Know your rights but pick your fights: document and collect evidence later rather than contesting facts in the moment.
- Keep calm, avoid hysteria, and prioritize getting home safely over immediate confrontation.
