It's hard to fathom the idea that more people have to die from COVID-19 before we come out on the other end of this pandemic. Is it time for political leaders of both parties to have an honest conversation about the moral trade-offs of this pandemic and how to balance them toward the public interest?

The world is rushing to produce a vaccine against COVID-19. We talk about the trade-offs of shortening a process that typically takes 10-15 years to complete and the ethical challenges of manufacturing one or more vaccines and how we choose to distribute them.

The Asian giant hornet has arrived in the U.S. for the first time -- and it doesn't bode well for honeybees. What are scientists doing to eradicate it?

GUESTS:

John Harris - Founding editor of Politico
Carl Zimmer - The author of 13 books about science; his latest is She Has Her Mother's Laugh: The Power, Perversions, and Potential of Heredity
Mike Baker - Seattle bureau chief for The New York Times

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Colin McEnroe and Cat Pastor contributed to this show.

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Pandemic And Moral Relativism; The Rush To A Vaccine; Asian Giant Hornets