3 Proven Ways to Motivate Strong-Willed Teenagers and Build Trust with Kirk Martin

Aug 27, 2024

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If you're struggling to connect with your strong-willed teenager and every conversation feels like a tug-of-war, you're not alone. In this episode, Dr. Cam sits down with parenting expert Kirk Martin, founder of CelebrateCalm.com and host of the Calm Parenting Podcast. Together, they share practical and actionable strategies to turn defiance and power struggles into calm, productive conversations. You'll learn how to motivate your strong-willed teen, build a trusting relationship, and navigate these challenging years with more peace and understanding.

Tune in to discover how changing your approach as a parent can transform your family dynamic and empower your teen to be their authentic self. Don’t miss out on these game-changing tips!

WHAT YOU'LL LEARN IN THIS EPISODE

How to Build a Close, Trusting Connection with your teen to motivate them without using control or manipulation.
Why Parents Should Focus on Changing Themselves instead of trying to change their teen's behavior.
The Power of Bonding by sharing interests with your teen and asking them to teach you something they’re passionate about.
How Releasing Parental Expectations can help your teen embrace their authentic self and take ownership of their actions.
The Importance of Normalizing Teen Challenges by understanding that their behavior is often a reaction to their environment, not an attack on you.

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TOP 5 TAKEAWAYS FOR PARENTS OF TEENS

Self-Reflection Is Key – Parents should focus on changing their own responses and mindset instead of trying to change their teen’s behavior. This shift can lead to better communication and fewer power struggles.
Empathy Over Control – Building a strong relationship with your teen starts with understanding their world, not trying to control it. Listening and empathizing is more powerful than imposing rules.
Bonding Over Shared Interests – Find common ground with your teen and engage in activities they love. Asking them to teach you something is a great way to build connection and show respect for their expertise.
Release the Pressure – Let go of strict expectations about who your teen should be. Empower them by recognizing their natural gifts and talents, which fosters confidence and independence.
Mentors Are Essential – Outside mentorship can provide your teen with additional support and guidance that may be more effective than what you can offer as a parent. Encourage them to seek out these valuable relationships.

RESOURCES MENTIONED IN THIS EPISODE

Calm Parenting Podcast

EPISODE CHAPTERS:

00:00 Introduction: Effective Strategies for Motivating Strong-Willed Teenagers
01:22 Kirk's Backstory: How to Transform the Parent-Teen Relationship
03:12 Self-Reflection in Parenting: Why Changing Yourself Helps Your Teen
06:25 How to Build a Strong Connection with Your Teen
09:44 The Power of Listening: Acknowledging Your Teen’s Voice
12:55 How to Work with Parents to Facilitate Positive Change
17:21 Motivating Your Teen: The Importance of Releasing Parental Expectations
20:37 Empowering Teenagers: Helping Them Discover Their Authentic Self
21:13 Building a Strong Emotional Bond with Your Teenager
25:37 Identifying and Creating Opportunities for Your Teen to Shine
30:51 Normalizing the Challenges of Raising Teenagers
37:15 How Social Media Affects Teen Behavior: Understanding the Impact

CONNECT WITH OUR GUEST: Kirk Martin

CONNECT WITH YOUR HOST: Dr. Cam Caswell

FULL TRANSCRIPT

Dr. Cam (00:01.646)
Hey parents, if you're struggling to get through to your strong-willed teenager, feeling like every conversation turns into a battle, you're not alone. Today we're diving into three ways to motivate strong-willed teenagers. I'm joined by a special guest who's a game changer in this area, Kirk Martin. Kirk is the founder of CelebrateCom.com and host of the Calm Parenting podcast. He’s mastered the art of transforming defiance and power struggles into productive conversations. Today, he’s going to share practical strategies to not only get our teens to listen but also build a close, trusting relationship with them. Kirk, welcome to the show.

Kirk (00:42.332)
Dr. Cam, I'm super excited to be here!

Dr. Cam (00:44.874)
Yes, this is great. Let's start with your backstory. What inspired you to start working with parents and their teenagers?

Kirk (00:53.02)
Our own son. Our son, Casey, came out of the womb with boxing gloves on – that kind of strong-willed kid who fights you over everything. Like most parents, I parented like my dad did: fear and intimidation, yelling, and screaming. But with a strong-willed child, you know this – they’re fight-or-flight kids. You double down on your discipline, and your strong-willed child will push back even harder.

Dr. Cam (01:22.375)
Exactly.

Kirk (01:23.644)
So, I spent the first seven or eight years of his life trying to change him, thinking, "He just needs to listen to me." But then I realized, no, I need to change myself. I was yelling at my son, telling him to calm down, when inside, he was probably thinking, "Apparently, you haven't mastered that skill at 35!" Everything changed when I changed. I stopped feeding off my anxiety, control issues, and perfectionism as a parent. Then, we did something a little weird that my wife hated. I said, “I have an awesome idea—let’s bring in strong-willed kids, kids on the spectrum, into our home for something called Lego camp.” The idea was to teach impulse control, emotion regulation, and social skills in real-life situations, not in an office. And all the kids came, not knowing they were being worked on. It was kind of like play therapy, but outside of an office setting.

We did that for a decade, and over 1,500 kids came through our home. That’s the backstory. Eventually, we started speaking, and I shifted from working with kids—which was the easy part—to working with the parents. You know this, Dr. Cam: we, as parents, bring so much baggage into it. But when I changed, everything shifted in the family dynamic.

Dr. Cam (03:10.34)
I love that. And I love how it started with your self-awareness because that’s the key to all of parenting—the ability to stop and ask, "What’s my part in this dynamic?" If we focus on changing our teen, nothing will change unless we're willing to change ourselves.

Kirk (03:30.684)
Yeah, that’s true. You know, when you're looking at that middle school child who's been in the same hoodie for 18 straight days, playing video games, and you start thinking, "Who’s going to marry this kid? Who’s going to hire this kid?" You start lecturing them, pointing out everything they're doing wrong.

Dr. Cam (03:32.302)
So, what’s the problem with that approach?

Kirk (03:57.924)
Eventually, they shut down or say, “Screw you” inside, thinking, “You're never happy with me.” The good news, though, is if our success as a family depends on changing our spouse or child, we’re in trouble. We can’t change another person. But if it depends on changing ourselves, we’ve got a shot. When you change yourself, it actually changes how your kids respond to you.

Dr. Cam (04:32.164)
100%. And when you started working with parents, my whole philosophy is the same. Teens won’t change unless we work with the parents. Once the parents change, the teens usually come along, too. So let’s talk about that typical teen—the one wearing the hoodie, hiding in their room playing games, and giving one-word responses when we ask about their day. A lot of parents take that very personally. They feel like their teen is pushing them out of their life, so they try to insert themselves more and more. Or they demand that their teen come down and spend time with them, regardless of whether the teen enjoys it. Why don’t these approaches work?

Kirk (05:27.516)
Well, kids—especially teens—are supposed to be independent, right? It would be weird if a 15-year-old said, "Mom, I’d rather spend time with you than my friends." That’s the normal stage for them. With strong-willed kids, the more you push, the more they resist. For me, it’s about drawing them to me and leading. For example, when our son was a teenager, if he brought something up, I would think, “I have this lecture in my head about how to choose friends.” But instead, I’d say, “Hey, Casey, I have some thoughts on that, but I need to get started on dinner. I’ll be in the garage, and if you want to come chat later, I’d love to share.” I wasn’t forcing it on him. They won’t come to you and say, “Dad, you have so much wisdom, I’m ready to hear it.” They’ll probably say, “Okay, what are your dumb ideas?” But I don’t take it personally. Any positive interaction is a win. It’s all about resetting expectations.

Dr. Cam (07:14.306)
Yes! That’s such a great point. And honestly, that’s a sign of healthy development. It’s normal for a teen to be a little sassy.

Kirk (07:18.908)
Right! It would be strange if they weren’t a little sassy at 13 or 16. There’s a difference between normal sass and outright defiance. If they’re calling you names or saying, “I hate you,” that’s a different issue. But the normal sass is just part of growing up.

Dr. Cam (07:39.902)
Exactly. What I’ve seen is that the more extreme attitude often comes after a lot of normal sass and being shut down or punished for it. They get frustrated when their normal attempts at independence aren’t accepted. Have you noticed that?

Kirk (08:07.164)
Yeah, Dr. Cam, do you agree with this? When they’ve crossed that threshold into anger and frustration, it’s almost like they’re crying out, “I’ve been trying to tell you this, but you’re not listening.” They’re not mature enough to say, “Dad, you haven’t adjusted well to my new independence. Can we talk about this?” So it just comes out in anger. Does that sound right?

Dr. Cam (08:41.546)
It's a hundred percent, and that's what the teens tell me all the time. Several of them have actually tried saying not exactly the words you've used, but have tried saying that and gotten shot down. Like, "You're being disrespectful telling me what I need to do." Right? And so teens don't have a voice. Even if they see this and ask for something to be changed, they don’t get heard. They get shut down, and that being shut down a few times leads to this: "I don't care anymore. If you're going to make my life miserable, I'm going to make your life miserable." And I see a lot of that.

Kirk (09:18.554)
And they'll win at that because the strong-willed kids don’t care about consequences, right? So you’ll be like, “Well, I’m going to take away all your video games,” and they’re like, “Fine. I will literally sit in my room and stare at the wall.” Then the parents are going to freak out. It’s not about winning in that situation. So, good. Yeah, I found people of all ages want to be heard. And it doesn't mean we have to endlessly listen to every little complaint—not that. But most of our teenagers, they're really bright kids, right? And I always tell parents, “Listen, they’re trying to tell you something.” It doesn’t mean you give in, you don’t buy them everything they want, not that. But when they do bring something up, I like the more humble approach, which is saying, “Hey, I need to apologize to you because I think I’ve spent the last five, seven, 13 years just lecturing you and just talking all the time, and I haven’t really listened.” And if you start listening, well, then they’re gonna come to you too, right? They might spend like seven minutes with you instead of a minute and a half at night. So, right? 'Cause I’m always with teens, I’m like, “Take any opportunity you can.” Because typical teenage life, to me, is—especially during the school year—they come home, they don’t want to talk about school.

By the way, can I share this one? Kind of a cool idea. So the strong-willed kids that we work with, they’re not always great at school. They’re really smart, but they’re not. So asking them after school, “Hey, how was your day at school?” It’s like, “Hey, how was that day at the place that you don’t have a lot of friends, you’re bored?” Yeah, it sucks. What else do you want to know, Mom? Right? And then the next question is, “Well, do you have any homework?” “No, I got it all done in study hall.” And they just lied to you.

Dr. Cam (10:44.206)
Yes, please.

Kirk (11:12.016)
That afternoon time after school, when you ask about their day, it sounds like an interrogation to them because it’s filled with our anxiety. "How did you do? How did you do on that test?" Because I need you to do well on that test so you can get a good grade, so you can get into the right college, so you can get a good job, so you can get that. So after school, sometimes, complete silence at times can be really wonderful. And if you want to have a conversation, this is really cool to say:
“Hey, you know what? Something happened to me today at the post office, at work, or in the political world. I’m curious, what would you do if you were in my situation?” And now you switch it from interrogating them about their day to listening to their ideas about your day. It’s a really cool thing to get them to open up.

Dr. Cam (12:02.432)
It is amazing, and I want to throw in there too that parents will listen to this and then they’ll go do it. They’ll ask exactly what you just said, and their kids will be like, “I don’t care.” So the reason I say this is because it’s not something that you can just snap and go, "Okay, I’m going to change my approach today," and they’re immediately going to change their response. That does not happen, right? What can parents...

Kirk (12:25.372)
No, it’s immediate, Dr. Cam. All you have to do is one time, and then they should... I’m kidding. No, of course, yeah. Well, by the time you get to the teen years, you’ve had at least 13 years, especially the kids we work with. I mean, they’re in trouble from the time they’re little. They’ve developed a defensive kind of shield around their heart. They’ve been in trouble a lot. It’s going to take time. And I always encourage parents: I’m after the really long game.

Dr. Cam (12:30.052)
Exactly. And everything changes.

Kirk (12:55.26)
I’m after these kids bringing their grandkids to you, right? Because, you know, you work with these families. Sometimes the relationship has been severed and hurt for 13 or 14 years. So I play the long game. And so, look, you change... anyway, I want you to change, not because you’re hoping for a result, but just because it’s the right thing to do, right? And it will bear fruit. It sometimes just takes time. Yeah, so do it a few times and don’t be discouraged when they say, “I don’t know.”

I tried your method and he said, “I don’t know.” I’m like, okay, because he’s waiting for you. He’s going to say something, and then your next question is going to be, “So how was school today? Did you get your homework done?” Like, you know what... An apology, I’ve realized as I’ve gotten older, apologies and praising kids are all just statements of fact. “Hey, I want to apologize because for the first...

Dr. Cam (13:35.549)
It’s a trap.

Kirk (13:52.572)
Thirteen years of your life, I think I’ve sent the message that you’re not capable of being successful. I’ve micromanaged you. I lecture you. I’m always on you about your room, your hygiene, all of this. And that’s about my own anxiety. I want to apologize. It’s not groveling. I don’t want to say, “I’ve been such a bad parent.” It’s just an acknowledgment of truth—that’s the way I’ve done it. And I can imagine that’s made you feel... and then you fill that in.
Like, “You could never please me.” That was mine with my son. “Hey Casey, it’s like you could never please me because I’m never really happy.” Right? I’ll say like, “Hey, good job, but...” So when I started having these discussions with him, he never looked at me and said, “Dad, that’s so meaningful to me that you would acknowledge that.” Not in the moment, but I could see it was like, “My dad’s getting it now.” And it was connecting with his heart, and it slowly began to shift our relationship.

Dr. Cam (14:55.854)
Yeah, I think that is so beautiful because we need to shift our focus not from getting the response we want from our kids. Because we’re setting them up to fail and us to be disappointed. But setting it up so that we are showing up the way we want to show up for them consistently and without expectation of how they’re going to respond. And I think that expectation is very difficult to manage.

Kirk (15:26.524)
That’s good, Dr. Cam. That’s good. We could end it right there. Boom. No, that’s the hard part. But that’s the same as it is for, you know, a three-year-old. It’s like, “Well, when’s my toddler going to start to get some self-discipline?” I’m like, “She’s not 40, okay?” Like, they’re developing. So yeah, I’m with you on that. You do the right thing, and the really great thing, which I know you’ve found is...

Dr. Cam (15:29.884)
Right there, mic drop, boom.

Kirk (15:55.534)
It changes you as a person. All that anxiety—it affects every relationship. And now, especially in the teen years, moms and dads, you've done a good job with your kids, right? If you're listening to a parenting podcast, you're a good parent. The bad ones aren’t tuning in. You've done everything. You've given every lecture, hopefully modeled things well. So now, throw that extra energy into changing yourself. You don’t need to make sandwiches anymore, you have more time. It will free you to enjoy the rest of your life, and your kids will see that. They’ll watch and say, "I just saw my mom or dad change right in front of my eyes." That’s the biggest lesson you could give them.

Dr. Cam (16:52.034)
Yeah, it's amazing when we do that. But I know parents are still thinking, "Okay, you’ve said if I listen and change, I’ll see results, but how do I get my teen to do what I want?" They want their teen to get up and do something. If their kid stays in their room all day, not motivated, they’re worried, “How do I put fire in their belly?”

Kirk (17:41.66)
You can’t put fire in their belly. That’s step one: You can’t do it. Parents, you’ve tried rewards, money, bribery. You’ve tried every consequence and punishment. It’s been 15 years, and none of that worked. So realize, you can’t do it for them.

Dr. Cam (17:43.62)
Thank you.

Kirk (18:11.844)
Building your connection with them is the most important thing you can do. Bonding over something they’re interested in is key. I know as a dad, I used to think, “Let me get my son interested in what I like.” My son was super into cars, and I hated cars. But every Saturday, we went to a dealership to look at cars and test drive them. It was agenda-free time. I wasn’t allowed to make dad analogies—no "life is like a car" talk. We just enjoyed each other.

Try to enjoy your teen. Smile at their attitude. They’re smart kids, and sometimes their comments are disrespectful, but clever too. I’d think, "That was really disrespectful, but well done." They’re smart.

Another idea for strong-willed kids: Ask them to teach you something. You’ve spent their whole life telling them what to do, but let them teach you something. Ask them to help with technology. My son helped me, and it gave him a sense of agency—he wasn’t the little boy anymore.

You also have to fight the anxiety. Your kids will change. Look, I was a dopey 15-year-old. If you looked at me back then, you’d think, "How is this kid going to succeed?" They grow and change. But I promise, the sooner you release them—say, "I release you to be who you are, to be the person you’re supposed to be"—that’s powerful language.

Dr. Cam (20:34.564)
That’s really powerful. I love that.

Kirk (20:37.702)
Can you talk about that for a minute? Because you’re good at this with teens—releasing them.

Dr. Cam (20:44.58)
From the teen perspective, they spend so much time trying to get approval from their parents. They end up disregarding who they are to meet their parents' expectations. So they start doubting themselves, not having the confidence to make decisions or share their opinions. This causes them to shut down.

When we release them from our expectations, it’s like cutting the cord. A lot of parents see their kids as an extension of themselves, which is why they try to control them. But if we see our kids as separate people, our role is to adapt to their needs.

Kirk (21:52.656)
Dr. Cam, that’s awesome. If you do that, then my second step would be this: For the next week, affirm everything your child is already doing well. Just relentlessly. "Hey, nice job with that." With strong-willed kids, keep it short and sweet. "I saw how you handled that. You’re growing." Don’t expect long thank-yous. Praise the small things, like when they bring their plate to the sink.

It’s easy to get irritated by the typical teen behavior—leaving the fridge open, eating snacks, leaving trash around. But when they do something good, even small things, acknowledge it. Simple stuff like, “I really love hearing your perspective.” No need for long speeches.

Dr. Cam (23:29.702)
It’s so uncomfortable.

Kirk (23:48.154)
Here’s something fantastic: If your kids play video games, recognize the positive traits they show. I hated video games. I wanted my son to be outside, but I realized when he played, he was goal-oriented, persistent, and a leader. I said to him, “I’ve noticed you’re really motivated and persistent when you’re on your video games. When you find your vision in life, you’ll use those qualities to crush it.” And then I gave him a fist bump and walked out.

Dr. Cam (24:12.452)
That’s great!

Kirk (24:15.704)
It’s about recognizing the good qualities they already have. Strong-willed kids may only do the bare minimum, but affirm their progress.

If I could give you one more tip: Help your kids use their natural gifts, talents, and passions outside the home. The neurotypical kids get praise for being good at school, but our strong-willed kids often don’t excel in the typical school setting. Outside the home, they can shine.

Dr. Cam (24:52)
That’s huge.

Kirk (25:00)
Let them use their gifts in other settings. And third, hold them accountable to another adult. Other adults see things you might not. They can hold your kids accountable in ways you can’t.

For example, if your kid loves soccer but struggles with school, find a coach who could use their help with younger kids. This external validation, from someone else, can be powerful.

I had a mom ask me about her teenage daughter with a bad attitude. I asked, “What does she love doing?” The daughter loved soccer and was great with little kids. I suggested she help out at a local soccer practice. The daughter was thrilled, and it gave her a sense of purpose. It worked because the recognition came from someone outside the family.

That’s the key—find a way to connect your kid’s passions with real-world opportunities.

Dr. Cam (27:56.94):
Yeah, that's a big difference. That right there separates whether it's going to work or not.

Kirk (28:02.78):
Yeah, so arrange that. They'll do it for someone else because they like pleasing others, just not you. So this girl, Rebecca, goes out on Tuesday night. She's in her environment, around little kids, and loves soccer. At the end of practice, she gets hugs from 12 little girls. When she comes home, does she have attitude? No, because her gifts were drawn out of her, and she had a purpose, something she was good at doing. The coach said, "We’ve got a game Saturday morning. Could you help out?" Of course, she’s there. After the game, two sets of parents came up to her and said, "Look, we don't know who you are, but our daughters never stopped talking about you. They're struggling in school. Would you consider tutoring them?" Not knowing that Rebecca hadn’t done schoolwork in years. But now, she has a reason to do it—because she wants to help these little kids. The key is to discover what motivates your child, not what motivates you.

As parents, we might be motivated by school because we were good at it and got attention. But maybe your child isn’t good at school. You need to discover what motivates them. The coach told Rebecca, "If you're going to work with these little kids, I better not hear from your mom that you're mouthing off. You better keep a B average if you’re going to help me because I’m looking for a leader." Now, Rebecca has something to work for.

We often do this with kids who are good with animals. Get them volunteering at a veterinarian's office. The vet might say, "You've got a gift with animals. You could be a vet one day." And that’s the first time someone has told that child they could be a veterinarian. Everyone else is focused on their grades and bad behavior. But the vet sees the gift. That’s when the child comes home and says, "Mom, I want to be a veterinarian." And mom’s thinking, "I’m not sure you're even making it out of middle school," but now they're motivated. So I’d encourage you to find their mission and a mentor. A mission they can throw themselves into.

Dr. Cam (30:51.438):
Yeah, that's the beauty of having your own podcast. You can go as long as you want.

Kirk (30:52.086):
I’ll give you one more, and I’m sorry for dominating the conversation. You know who’s really good with teenagers? Older people. Find an older couple in your neighborhood and have them reach out to your teenager. Ask them for help with something they can’t do anymore. Your teenager walks in, and they’re going to love on them. They miss having kids around, and they’ll teach them about life. Your teens will come home saying, "Yeah, I like the Robinsons down the street. They said that I'm really good at X." And then, just send them to do their homework, and they'll spend a lot of time with that old couple. It's a really effective strategy for teens. Older people are very grounding for teens. They've been through hard times, and they don’t carry all that anxiety. They can reach into a teenager's heart in a way that other people can’t. They'll say, "I remember what that was like," even if it was back in 1947. There's something beautiful about that.

Dr. Cam (32:19.78):
I really, really love that. And I think it's beneficial for both sides because the couple probably loves having that younger energy too. But having someone who has no agenda, who can purely see the child’s heart and authenticity, and just be okay with whatever that is—it's priceless. When teens act out, it's a cry for exactly that. That’s why they have attitude. They're not just being nasty for the sake of it. It's not like they all meet online and say, “Let’s be mean today.” They’re reacting to their environment. If they're reacting poorly, that means the environment isn't giving them what they need to thrive. That’s not their fault.

Kirk (33:20.925):
Preach it. I love that. I can tell you're passionate about it because it’s true. You begin to control your own anxiety, affirm them for what they're doing well, and then put them in situations where they can help little kids, work with animals, or be around older people. You’ll see a subtle shift. But be patient. They're fighting 13, 15, 17 years of a different way. So go slowly with it. It’s a cool process. My number one piece of advice is to enjoy your teenagers. Enjoy a little bit of that attitude. Enjoy their energy. Ask them about their friends. They’ll talk inappropriately, of course, and sometimes just laugh. You might think, “That’s inappropriate,” but it's actually spot-on. Like, "Sarah’s mom is a little like that." You’re right.

Dr. Cam (34:18.744):
Yeah. And I think it’s also about accepting their language. Just because they don’t use our language doesn’t mean it’s disrespectful. I see so many people complaining about their kids calling them "bro." But that’s actually a term of endearment. For them, it’s not disrespectful—it's them being chummy. Parents get upset, but it’s just their way of connecting. Understanding their language can make a big difference.

Kirk (34:40.93):
It is. You can always look at it if they use it in a disrespectful way, right? But when they say, "Okay, bro," you can have some fun with it. The next time they ask for something, you can say, "Hey, it’s unfortunate, but your bro doesn’t have money and can’t drive. But your dad can." I did that with my son once. But you can have fun with it instead of saying, “When I was a kid, if I’d called my dad bro…” Right? That just means you're really old.

Dr. Cam (35:13.928):
It does! And I tell parents this all the time: You are not as amazing and perfect as you think you were. I can guarantee you drove your parents crazy too.

Kirk (35:26.012):
Yeah, I always tell dads, “Look, you were a dopey 8-year-old and a clueless 14-year-old. You were just trying to figure life out. They’re just trying to figure life out too.” I always tell parents, relax a little. It's like, yes, we have to train them, but remember—they're not 35 yet. Same with teenagers. They're not grown-ups yet. When it comes to toddlers, I tell parents, “Write a job description for a 3-year-old.” It's not to wake up, put on a suit, and be perfect—it’s to make messes, be curious, and explore. It's the same with teenagers. They’re not adults. But one other thing I’d throw in is normalizing the teen years for them.

This is a weird time in life. There's no other time when you’re grouped in classes with kids your own age, listening to people talk about stuff you just don’t care about, and dealing with all the social stuff. As an adult, you get to choose so much, but right now, it's hard. So, if they feel awkward, they should. Because they are. Just don’t tell them that.

Dr. Cam (36:27.074):
Yeah, it's terrible.

Kirk (36:47.18):
Absolutely. Their hormones are out of control. They're not even in control of their own bodies, half the time. Their minds and thoughts are all over the place. It's a wonder how teenage boys can even pay attention in class when there's Instagram out there, with all those images they can see. Seriously. I mean, I don’t know how they get up in the morning and do anything.

Dr. Cam (37:11.99):
Exactly. It's true.

Kirk (37:15.78):
I didn't mean to be inappropriate, but as teenage boys, we had to sneak around to see pictures in a magazine. And now it's like, my Instagram feed is full of girls with no clothes on. Like that's a hard world to navigate. We didn't have this whole social media thing. It's hard for us as adults too—our friends are posting about vacations, and we’re left wondering, "How come we didn’t take that nice vacation?"

Dr. Cam (37:44.342):
Right? I’ll tell you, I see more pressure coming from parents based on what they see on Instagram and social media, which they then put on their kids because they say, "Well, look, all my friends' kids are doing this. So you need to do it too." Parents, you can't use your phone to judge your kids and what you see on their phones to judge them. That’s a hard thing. And I think the other thing—and I’m curious what your thoughts are on this—I personally am highly annoyed with how much emphasis is being put on social media and tech as the cause of mental health issues. I see it more as a symptom than the actual cause of the problem.

Kirk (38:28.764):
I agree. And this is where I’m not about guilt-blaming parents, right? I’m very honest with parents. I’ll say, "Hey, you're a freak in that area. You need to stop that." But if you have a really good bond and a trusting relationship with your child, and they’re doing some positive, constructive things—that’s my goal with the mission and mentor—let’s just start with something simple. Let’s just take them 30 minutes down to the Robinson’s house one day a week. If they’re doing that, then the outside pressures of social media won’t hit them as hard. They’re a little inoculated. But if they always feel like they can never please their parents, and everyone’s trying to make them be someone they’re not, then they’re much more susceptible to things like vaping and other risky behaviors. Focus on the connection. Stay close to your kids.

And even if they just sit in their room and don’t get good grades, you have smart kids. Once they get a vision for their life, strong-willed kids often just do the bare minimum to get by all the way through high school. And you’ll think, "But you’re not doing this, or not doing that." But I’m telling you—it’s strategically brilliant.

Dr. Cam (39:43.96):
That’s right. They’re working smart, not hard.

Kirk (39:46.588):
Why would they do extra work to get grades they don’t care about? We told them, "In order to keep your screens, you have to maintain exactly a 79.3 average." And they’ll get a 79.3—not a 79.4. But why wouldn’t they do their best? Because they’re not motivated by it. Then, as they get a little older, gain vision, and take ownership of their lives, they turn it on. I’ll tell you, the strong-willed kids have it harder, but they’re not made to be kids. You put them in the adult world, and they crush it.

Look, our son, Casey, was horrible as a child. He didn’t clean his room and was awful. But in the real world, which is what you’re raising them for—you’re not raising kids to be kids, you’re raising them to be adults—Casey crushes it. He’s just terrible at all the arbitrary kid stuff. And parents, cleaning their bedrooms? There’s a reason there’s a door. Just chill. You’re a freak. Own that. And by the way, if there’s a fire, they’ll be able to get out. That’s an excuse. Sit in the mess until it doesn’t trigger you.

Dr. Cam (40:54.39):
Yeah, I know. We are so on the same page, Kirk. I’m exactly the same way. I’ve got the messy room and I’m like, "Do not even leave that cracked open because it’ll give me heart palpitations." But it’s your space. It’s not my space. You deal with it the way you want to deal with it. I agree with everything you’re saying. I love that. So, Kirk, how do people find you?

Kirk (41:13.638):
You can look up the Calm Parenting Podcast. That’s the best way. We’re also at CelebrateCalm.com, but the Calm Parenting Podcast is the main one. You can email us if you have specific issues with teens or kids. Some of you probably have younger kids too—hopefully, more compliant, easy ones. But hopefully not. Because the strong-willed kids will change you and make you a different person. It’s awesome. So yeah, check out the podcast.

Dr. Cam (41:48.576):
I love it. Thank you so much, Kirk, for joining us today. I really appreciate you. You’re awesome.

Kirk (41:51.142):
Dr. Cam, you’re awesome. I can’t wait to send a lot of our teens directly to your podcast because your approach is so great. You’re chill, you’re not freaking out about stuff, and you’re really good at this. Thank you for what you’re doing.

Dr. Cam (42:05.55):
Thank you. Absolutely.

About the Show:

The Parenting Teens with Dr. Cam Podcast is your go-to resource for navigating the challenges of raising teenagers. Hosted by Dr. Cam Caswell, an adolescent psychologist and certified parenting coach, this podcast offers practical parenting strategies, expert advice, and real-world insights to help you build a stronger relationship with your teen and support their emotional growth. Whether you’re struggling with teenage behavior or looking to improve communication, each episode provides actionable tips to make parenting teens easier and more rewarding. Perfect for both new and seasoned parents, this podcast helps you build the confidence to handle teen challenges and thrive together.

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