The Breakfast Club INTERVIEW: Jonathan Karl Talks New Book 'Retribution', Trump Administration, Free Speech, Biden + More
Nov 17, 2025
Jonathan Karl, a veteran political journalist and author of 'Retribution', sheds light on the tumultuous landscape of U.S. politics. He discusses the possibility of Trump’s comeback, the theme of retribution in campaigns, and how Trump's style has reshaped the Republican Party. Karl reveals insights on the reluctance of sources to speak on the record and warns about the erosion of checks and balances under Trump. He also highlights the role of the Supreme Court and the ongoing risk to free speech, emphasizing the need for resilient journalism amidst these challenges.
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Executive Power Redefined
- Jonathan Karl argues Trump's second term is reshaping American government by expanding executive power and sidelining checks and balances.
- He warns this phase shows a president willing to ignore Congress and test the limits of the courts, changing norms permanently.
Retribution As Campaign Strategy
- Karl traces the campaign's energy to Trump's CPAC “retribution” line and the sequence of indictments that energized his base.
- He links symbolic choices like rallying at Waco and courtroom resentments to a deliberate revenge narrative.
First Targets Were Republican Critics
- Karl describes Trump's immediate post-White House focus on targeting Republicans who opposed him, starting with Liz Cheney's defeat in Wyoming.
- He shows retribution targeted at perceived betrayers, not just Democrats or prosecutors.
