Ep. 269 – Ram Dass and Stephen Levine: An Opportunity to Grow

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Jan 20, 2025

Stephen Levine, an influential poet and Buddhist teacher, joins Ram Dass in a profound discussion about life, death, and spiritual growth. They explore how every experience, including dying, offers an opportunity to awaken beyond the illusion of separateness. Levine shares a moving story about an AIDS patient learning to approach pain with love rather than anger. They also talk about the importance of shared experiences and love in healing, and how embracing vulnerability can lead to deeper connections and personal transformation.

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INSIGHT

Shared Trauma & Healing

Ram Dass realized that shared trauma heals separateness by bringing forth caring qualities.
The AIDS crisis fostered connection and healing among diverse individuals.

INSIGHT

Life as an Opportunity for Growth

Life, including death, is an opportunity for awakening from the illusion of separateness.
Every experience, even mundane ones, offers a chance to grow spiritually.

ADVICE

Antidote to Burnout

To avoid burnout, view life and death as growth opportunities.
Seek evidence beyond the physical to understand your existence as more than just your body.

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Ram Dass and Stephen Levine explore how all the experiences in our lives, including the process of dying, can be an opportunity to grow and awaken out of the illusion of separateness.

This episode of Here and Now is part two of a talk by Ram Dass and Stephen Levine in San Francisco in the 1980s during the AIDS crisis. You can listen to part one on Ep. 268 of the Here & Now podcast: The Heart of Healing.

Ram Dass talks about how we are being healed out of our separateness through our shared caring and our shared heart. Everything in our lives, including the process of dying, is an opportunity to grow. He explores how we need to shift our perspectives to touch the possibility that we are more than our bodies.
Stephen addresses the AIDS crisis and the sense of anger and self-hatred that gathers around the pain people experience as they come closer to death. He shares the powerful story of one AIDS patient he was working with who started to meet his pain with loving kindness instead of with hatred.
Ram Dass talks about opening not just to physical pain but to psychological pain as well. He shares some of the heavy learning he’s had to do in order to allow himself to need help from others. To do the work he really wanted to do, Ram Dass needed to acknowledge the fullness of his own humanity first.

About Stephen Levine:

Stephen Levine was an American poet, author and Buddhist teacher best known for his work on death and dying. He was a friend and colleague to many Be Here Now Network Teachers. Along with Jack Kornfield, Joseph Goldstein and Sharon Salzberg, Stephen is responsible for making the teachings of Theravada Buddhism more widely available to students in the West. Find more talks and writings from Stephen at levinetalks.com.

The Ram Dass community gathers regularly to engage in meaningful discussions about the podcast. We invite you to join us and share your curiosities, insights, and wisdom. Visit Ramdass.org/fellowship to sign up for the General Fellowship, and you'll receive event invitations directly in your inbox.

“And at the simplest level, I’d say the statement is the antidote to burnout is the perspective that you are a growing being and that everything, including your own life and your own death, and approaching death, is an opportunity to grow.” – Ram Dass

Sponsors of this Episode:

Ram Dass Here & Now is brought to you by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at betterhelp.com/ramdass and get on your way to being your best self.

Reunion is offering $250 off any stay to the Love, Serve, Remember community. Simply use the code “BeHere250” when booking. Disconnect from the world so you can reconnect with yourself at Reunion. Hotel | www.reunionhotelandwellness.com Retreats | www.reunionexperience.org

This show is also sponsored by Magic Mind, a matcha-based energy shot infused with nootropics and adaptogens designed to crush procrastination, brain fog, & fatigue. Get 45% off the Magic Mind bundle with our link: magicmind.com/ramdassjan

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