Outrage + Optimism: The Climate Podcast

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Kim Stanley Robinson on Pre Traumatic Imagination and the stories that change us

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Nov 27, 2025

Guest

Kim Stanley Robinson

In this engaging conversation, acclaimed author Kim Stanley Robinson shares insights from his groundbreaking work on climate fiction. He discusses the purpose behind the devastating opening of *The Ministry for the Future*, revealing its intent to inspire action from despair. Robinson introduces the concept of 'pre-traumatic syndrome,' urging the use of imaginative foresight to motivate preventive measures against climate catastrophe. He also emphasizes the importance of personal and societal projects, persistence in the face of challenge, and how storytelling shapes our collective future.

36:35

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INSIGHT

Why The Start Is A Moral Shock

Kim Stanley Robinson wrote Chapter One to show humans cannot adapt to wet-bulb 35°C and to jolt readers into facing that reality.
He intended the opening as a moral punch to motivate action rather than horror for its own sake.

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INSIGHT

Stories Need Defeat And Diversity

Cultural stories should mix defeats and diverse voices to move people from despair to determination.
Kim Stanley Robinson emphasizes that many setbacks are necessary parts of a collective project toward biosphere repair.

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ADVICE

Choose A Project That Connects To Purpose

Find and commit to a personal project that orients your life and connects to society's needs.
Kim Stanley Robinson urges stepping into the historical project of biosphere repair rather than dodging it.

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Meeting Kim Stanley Robinson at COP

06:44 • 1min

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Why open with a devastating first chapter

07:53 • 2min

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Impact of that opening on readers

10:22 • 2min

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From despair to determination in storytelling

12:23 • 2min

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The existential 'project' that motivates action

13:53 • 3min

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Historical urgency and the crux decades

16:47 • 3min

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Lessons from historical persistence

19:31 • 1min

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Personal transformation after trauma

20:52 • 2min

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Pre-traumatic syndrome and action

22:58 • 3min

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Technology, law and choosing cleaner systems

26:20 • 2min

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AI's role and mistakes to avoid

28:40 • 3min

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Future climate fiction and the Arctic idea

31:25 • 2min

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Book's cultural ripple and real-world initiatives

Science in the Capital series

Kim Stanley Robinson

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Three Californias Trilogy

Kim Stanley Robinson

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#6039

• Mentioned in 6 episodes

Mars Trilogy

Kim Stanley Robinson

The Mars trilogy, consisting of 'Red Mars' (1992), 'Green Mars' (1993), and 'Blue Mars' (1996), follows the settlement and terraforming of Mars from 2026 to 2212. The series explores the technological, moral, social, and political evolution of the Martian colony through the perspectives of a diverse cast of characters. It delves into themes such as the debate between 'Reds' who want to preserve Mars in its natural state and 'Greens' who advocate for terraforming, the formation of new societies, and the complex relationships between Earth and Mars. The trilogy is known for its detailed analysis of philosophical, political, and geological aspects of the Martian environment and its potential for human habitation.

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• Mentioned in 4 episodes

New York 2140

Kim Stanley Robinson

Manuel Mata

New York 2140 is set in a future New York City that has been drastically altered by climate change. The city has experienced a significant rise in sea levels, flooding much of Manhattan and transforming it into a 'Super Venice. ' The novel follows the lives of multiple characters living in the MetLife Tower, which has been adapted to withstand the flooding. It delves into themes of economic and social change, critiquing capitalism and unregulated financial systems while highlighting the resilience and adaptability of the city's inhabitants. The story involves various plotlines, including a search for missing residents, attempts to reform the global financial system, and the struggle for housing and resources in a post-climate catastrophe world.

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• Mentioned in 5 episodes

The Future We Choose

Surviving the Climate Crisis

Tom Rivett-Carnac

Christiana Figueres

The Future We Choose presents two contrasting scenarios for the planet by 2050: one where we fail to meet the Paris Agreement’s climate targets, leading to a world of severe climate consequences, and another where we achieve a regenerative, carbon-neutral world. The authors argue for confronting the climate crisis head-on with determination and optimism, outlining what governments, corporations, and individuals must do to prevent disaster. The book emphasizes the importance of hope, collective action, and the adoption of three essential mindsets: stubborn optimism, endless abundance, and radical regeneration.

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• Mentioned in 54 episodes

The Ministry for the Future

Kim Stanley Robinson

The Ministry for the Future is a novel by Kim Stanley Robinson that delves into the urgent issue of climate change. Set in the near future, the story follows the establishment of a UN agency, the Ministry for the Future, whose mission is to advocate for the rights of future generations. The novel is told through multiple perspectives, including those of Mary Murphy, the head of the Ministry, and Frank May, an American aid worker who survives a devastating heat wave in India. The book explores various innovative solutions to climate change, such as the introduction of a new currency called 'carboni' to incentivize decarbonization, and it presents a hopeful yet realistic vision of how humanity might cooperate to mitigate the effects of climate change. The narrative includes a mix of fictional eyewitness accounts, non-fiction descriptions, and diverse writing styles, reflecting the complexity and urgency of the climate crisis.

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2312

Kim Stanley Robinson

In 2312, humanity has spread across the solar system, colonizing planets, moons, and asteroids. The novel follows Swan Er Hong from Mercury and Fitz Wahram from Titan as they navigate a complex web of events that force humanity to confront its past, present, and future. The story delves into advanced technologies, terraforming, and the political and economic structures of a future society, while also exploring themes of climate change, human enhancement, and the colonization of space.

This week on Outrage + Optimism, we’re taking a breath.

After two intense weeks of daily updates from COP30 in Belém, we’re returning to weekly programming with something different - a slower, deeper, more reflective conversation that felt too valuable to cut.

While in the Blue Zone, we sat down with Kim Stanley Robinson, the acclaimed author of The Ministry for the Future, 2312, The Mars trilogy, and the Science in the Capital series. His writing has been read by negotiators, ministers, campaigners, and many of you.

In our conversation, Kim Stanley Robinson reflects on why The Ministry for the Future begins with such a devastating opening chapter, a “punch in the gut” designed to reveal the human limits of adaptation. He introduces the idea of “pre-traumatic syndrome,” the unsettling clarity that comes from imagining a catastrophe before it happens, and how this can motivate us rather than paralyse us. We explore storytelling as a cultural tool for moving from despair to determination, and why each of us needs a a unifying purpose that gives shape to our actions in a chaotic world.

At a COP defined by urgency, exhaustion, and flashes of courage, this wide-ranging conversation with Kim Stanley Robinson felt like a necessary exhale, a moment to step back and reflect on why we do this work, and what kind of future we’re choosing to build.

We’re airing the conversation almost exactly as it happened.

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Series Producer: Ben Weaver-Hincks

Planning Producer: Caitlin Hanrahan

Edited by: Miles Martignoni

Exec Producer: Ellie Clifford

This is a Persephonica production for Global Optimism and is part of the Acast Creator Network.

Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

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