fiction/non/fiction E9 E3: Jelani Cobb on Race, Politics and the ‘Trayvon Martin Generation’
New Yorker staff writer Jelani Cobb joins co-hosts Whitney Terrell and V.V. Ganeshananthan to discuss his new essay collection, Three or More is a Riot: Notes on How We Got Here: 2012-2025. Cobb recalls how he began the project by trying to understand how George Zimmerman’s killing of unarmed black teenager Trayvon Martin in 2012 set the tone for the era to come. Cobb considers how history’s exceptions skew narratives, so that writers miss the bigger picture. He reflects on how discourse about race shifted between the Obama, Trump, and Biden administrations and considers the juxtaposition of Martin’s murder with Obama’s presidency. Cobb also speaks on the significance of transparency in journalism, calling for reporters to show their work to reinforce public trust. He explains his preference for a lowercase “b” in “black” as a racial term, given that the word is not a proper noun, does not designate a nationality, and that capitalization may perpetuate inaccurate racial ideologies. Cobb reads from Three or More Is a Riot.
To hear the full episode, subscribe through iTunes, Google Play, Stitcher, Spotify, or your favorite podcast app (include the forward slashes when searching). You can also listen by streaming from the player below. Check out video versions of our interviews on the Fiction/Non/Fiction Instagram account, the Fiction/Non/Fiction YouTube Channel, and our show website: https://www.fnfpodcast.net/
This podcast is produced by V.V. Ganeshananthan, Whitney Terrell, and Bri Wilson, Emma Baxley, Hope Wampler, and Elly Meman.
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Three or More Is a Riot: Notes on How We Got Here: 2012-2025
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The Matter of Black Lives: Writing from The New Yorker, edited with David Remnick
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The Essential Kerner Commission Report, edited with Matthew Guariglia
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The Substance of Hope: Barack Obama and the Paradox of Progress
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"Lessons of Later-in-Life Fatherhood" | The New Yorker, June 14, 2025
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