Pianist and researcher Philipp Teriete discusses the 19th-century improvisation and partimento, the influence of Pierre-Joseph-Guillaume Zimmerman, Chopin's music education, the role of harmony for virtuoso pianists, the evolution of concert stage piano performance, the influence of formal music education on ragtime musicians, and upcoming research projects in jazz and music education.
The tradition of improvisation and partimento in the 19th century was significant in shaping the musical landscape and education of pianist composers like Chopin.
Pierre-Joseph-Guillaume Zimmermann played a crucial role in the Paris Conservatory, training renowned musicians such as Charles Valentin Alkan, Jox Bizé, and César Franck.
Frédéric Chopin received a comprehensive education, studying counterpoint and thorough bass, challenging the idea that he was self-taught and highlighting his interest in music theory.
Deep dives
The Tradition of Improvisation and Partimento in the 19th Century
Philip Turita discusses the tradition of improvisation and its link with partimento in the 19th century. He explores the education of great pianist composers like Chopin and highlights the importance of understanding the training methods used during that time.
The Pedagogy of Pierre-Joseph-Guillaume Zimmermann at the Paris Conservatory
Philip Turita delves into the pedagogy of Pierre-Joseph-Guillaume Zimmermann, the head of the Paris Conservatory Piano Department in the first half of the 19th century. Turita highlights the influence of Zimmermann in shaping the musical landscape of Paris and mentions his famous students like Charles Valentin Alkan, Jox Bizé, and César Franck.
The Education of Chopin and the Influence of 19th Century European Music Theory
Philip Turita discusses the early teachers of Frédéric Chopin and their influence on his musical education. Turita explores the training methods used in Warsaw, including the study of counterpoint and thorough bass, which had similarities to the curriculum of the Paris Conservatory. He also mentions Chopin's possession of a manual on counterpoint by Yara-Sun, suggesting his interest in music theory.
Chopin's Thorough Training and Education
Chopin's education was more thorough than previously believed. He studied at the Warsaw Conservatory, which was modeled after the Paris curriculum. Chopin received private lessons from the director of the conservatory and was trained on various instruments. He also took counterpoint lessons, studying six hours a week. Contrary to previous claims, Chopin was not self-taught and had extensive training.
Chopin's Unfinished Piano Method
Chopin had plans to create his own piano method but never finished it. He wanted his friends, Henri Reber and Auguste Franchomme, to complete his work after his death. The reason behind asking Reber, a music theorist and composer, to finish his piano method is still debated. It is possible that Chopin admired Reber's expertise in theory and composition. However, the ultimate goal of Chopin's unfinished method remains a topic for speculation and research.
It’s my pleasure to introduce my guest today, pianist, composer, educator, and researcher, Philipp Teriete. Today we will explore the improvisation and partimento in the 19th century, the great French music teacher Pierre-Joseph-Guillaume Zimmerman, Frederic Chopin's music education, the influence of German music theory in early ragtime and jazz composers and so much more!
0:38 What is your background and how did you come to your present areas of research? 4:40 Who was Pierre-Joseph-Guillaume Zimmerman? 5:55 Did he have any famous pupils? 7:27 What was Zimmerman’s training? 9:17 Was he a victim of the cult of genius? 10:41 Was Zimmerman consigned to historical oblivion before your research? 12:55 Partimento and Zimmerman 14:21 Zimmerman’s holistic approach to teaching music 17:00 How was Zimmerman different from someone like Fenaroli? 18:10 Zimmerman’s recommendation of solfege 19:23 Needing to read 7 clefs right at the beginning with Zimmerman 20:33 How long does it take to be acquainted with 7 clefs? 21:23 Zimmerman calling pianists who have no knowledge of harmony, “schoolboys” 22:37 Cherubini giving Liszt and Berlioz a hard time 23:05 Zimmerman rejecting Louis Moreau Gottschalk from entering the Paris Conservatory 24:09 Did Zimmerman teach the Rule of the Octave and Moti del basso? 24:35 Were these 19th century versions of these things? 26:23 Zimmerman’s method leading to free composition and counterpoint 29:00 Are Zimmerman’s technical piano teachings comparable to someone like Hanon? 30:56 Frederic Chopin, how did he learn music? 32:19 What’s the evidence for the claim that Josef Elsner’s curriculum was modeled after the Paris Conservatory? 33:27 Chopin studying 6 hours a week of counterpoint with Elsner 34:06 Chopin and the cult of the genius 34:51 Could he be considered a formally trained musician instead of self-taught? 35:47 Were these all treatises that Elsner used to teach Chopin? 36:14 Did Chopin know the Rule of the Octave? 36:43 What about Chopin and Partimento? 39:05 What was Henri Reber’s lineage of teaching music theory? 39:46 Were Henri Reber and Chopin good friends? 40:27 Chopin’s plan to write his own piano method 41:35 Why would Chopin ask a music theorist/composer to help him with his piano method 42:33 Was Chopin 100% focused on completing his method? 43:14 Chopin being very musically opinionated and yet asking several friends to finish his piano method 44:42 Friedrich Kalkbrenner’s negative image 47:33 People dismissing great composers as “inferior” 48:57 How would Chopin analyze his own music? 52:10 Francis Plante’s video recordings of Chopin Etudes at age 90 53:26 Ragtime - Do we have any evidence that Scott Joplin and Tom Turpin had any formal music training? 55:06 Do we know for sure that Scott Joplin had a counterpoint treatise in his possession? 58:32 The Leipzig Conservatory and Generalbass 59:13 Roman Numerals, Harmonic Function Theory, Generalbass and Counterpoint - a Nuanced take 1:01:34 Were Leipzig Conservatory students learning Stufentheorie and Generalbass at the same time? 1:02:45 Joplin’s counterpoint treatise containing many notes and annotations 1:03:56 On counterpoint being something that takes years to study 1:05:34 If you study counterpoint already, what’s the need for Stufentheorie or Roman Numerals? 1:07:30 Is Wagner influenced by the German theories of music? 1:10:33 Counterpoint vs chord invertibility 1:14:17 Wrapping Up
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