On Point with Meghna Chakrabarti | Podcast Why the flag burning debate is still not settled
Sep 22, 2025
This discussion features David Cole, a Georgetown Law professor and former ACLU national legal director, alongside Josh Hammer, a conservative commentator and senior counsel at the Article III Project. They delve into the clash between flag burning as free speech and President Trump’s call for criminalization. Cole highlights the Supreme Court's stance and the historical context, while Hammer argues for the dangers of flag desecration. The conversation reveals how symbols like the American flag evoke strong emotions and the complexities of balancing national pride with democratic dissent.
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Joey Johnson's Dallas Protest
- Gregory Lee Johnson burned an American flag during a 1984 protest at the Republican National Convention in Dallas and was arrested on the spot.
- He was convicted under a Texas law and appealed, arguing flag burning was protected political speech.
Flag Burning Is Protected Speech
- The Supreme Court's 5-4 decision in Texas v. Johnson held flag burning is protected symbolic speech under the First Amendment.
- The Court emphasized government cannot punish expression solely because it is offensive.
Congress Tried A Statutory Fix
- Congress passed the Federal Flag Protection Act of 1989 after the Supreme Court ruling, and activists immediately tested it by burning flags at the Capitol.
- The law was challenged and the Supreme Court again ruled for protection in the subsequent Eichman decision.
