Transforming Work with Sophie Wade 139: Dan Bladen & Dave Cairns - The Rhythm and Flow of People, Work, Place, and Space
Dan Bladen, CEO and co-founder of Kadence, and Dave Cairns, Future of Work Strategist at Kadence, each discuss aspects of the evolving dynamics of modern workplaces and spaces. Dan shares insights from Kadence’s journey developing workplace technology and breaking down and rebuilding work to facilitate workflow and rhythm for distributed workers. Dave highlights the benefits of data-driven understanding of people flow and space utilization as well as intentional gatherings. They recognize flexible hybrid models’ acceptance and leaders’ increasingly purposeful coordination.
TAKEAWAYS
Dan Bladen Interview
[01:22] Dan explains his background in theology, music, and technology.
[02:57] Growing up with engineers, hardware, and gaming encouraged Dan to build computers.
[05:04] Traveling around the world in 2012, connectivity and charging are basic needs.
[05:40] Dan co-founds Chargify to make wireless charging a game changer as WiFi did for connectivity.
[06:41] Dan notices offices were already half-empty as people start ‘agile working’ in the 2010s.
[07:25] The business of checking an employee into a hot desk while also charging their laptop.
[08:06] Strong growth stops with the pandemic, then a Fortune 50 company asks to use Chargify’s software to enable safe office-based work.
[09:36] The checking-in capability leads to a business pivot to workplace coordination software.
[11:02] Dan isn’t enthralled, but the market is large and 90% of companies are going hybrid.
[12:20] Dan sees the potential of hybrid work to benefit from more work-life balance.
[12:44] Finding rhythm with your family and your team and having a contract with your employer.
[13:35] In the past, people had to act predictably as spaces were static.
[14:36] Kadence philosophy breaks down the ‘work stack’—starting with the ‘why’ of work—vision and values
[15:13] Moving from performative inputs to quantitative outputs.
[16:10] Work defined by time not place—so what is the work ‘operating system’?
[18:08] Kadence starts as desk-booking software and becomes a hybrid work management platform.
[20:05] The hybrid shift is influenced by market conditions and economic pressures.
[21:00] Data shows the best-performing companies are hybrid.
[21:40] Servant leadership is rising and thinking about culture and the next generation.
[22:51] Over 50% of hybrid companies now organize regular in-person events.
[23:16] Time to trust is accelerated during face-to-face times of togetherness.
[23:29] Leaders must be intentional about when and where they gather their teams.
Dave Cairns Interview
[24:32] Dave discusses how deep friendships build up live and asynchronously.
[25:33] The mismatch between real estate supply and demand that Dave notices in 2019.
[26:10] Pandemic shifts remind Dan of his poker-playing time when he was working remotely.
[27:37] Merging two experiences, learning more about the nature of work, beyond office space.
[28:07] Learning from many sources for the first time that office spaces pre-COVID were half empty.
[29:30] Dave’s content resonates with people struggling with their working lives and rigid policies.
[30:36] Many workers feel forced into office attendance without a clear reason.
[32:23] Canada has a quieter acceptance of hybrid work compared to the U.S.
[33:19] New York seems to have the most polarized views on remote and in-office policies.
[36:17] The mismatch between work policies/mandates and actual employee behaviors.
[37:26] Employees often coordinate informally and inefficiently, giving organizations no insights.
[38:27] Most firms still lack clear data on how their offices are actually being used.
[40:30] Some leaders demand full office occupancy despite low attendance rates.
[41:06] Gathering granular data to understand people flow and office space utilization.
[42:06] High lease costs, renewals or financial pressure are key factors to drive real change.
[43:19] Proactive companies learn workflow and people coordination before downsizing space.
[46:04] Leaders are balancing executive mandates with employee flexibility to achieve results.
[49:31] Companies recognize hybrid’s importance but lack the knowledge to execute well.
[51:56] IMMEDIATE ACTION TIP: Have an intentional gathering strategy. Accept that teams can make some of their own decisions. Figure out how your office spaces, your workspaces, if you have any, are being used.
RESOURCES
QUOTES
“Now there's this opportunity for people to be more unpredictable and spaces to be flexible.” – Dan Bladen.
“So the only way to measure if that work was getting done was by measuring and observing the quality of the outputs.” – Dan Bladen.
“We started rebuilding it [work]. And really it boils down to people, places and the projects that they're working on.” – Dan Bladen.
“Work doesn't happen in a place anymore. It actually happens in the working week. And where you choose to place yourself is part of your toolkit and your coordination layer.” – Dan Bladen.
“Work is going to be reimagined a bit like an OS.” – Dan Bladen.