Mormon and Neurodivergent (Autism and ADHD) - Paul Martinez | Ep. 1986
Jan 24, 2025
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Join Paul Martinez, a courageous Mormon convert with high-functioning autism and ADHD, as he shares his deeply personal journey. He discusses how neurodivergence can lead to vulnerabilities in abusive relationships and the emotional complexities of faith in a high-demand religious context. Paul reflects on childhood challenges, family dynamics, and the transformative impact of embracing his identity. With insightful anecdotes, he navigates the intersection of mental health and spirituality, celebrating resilience and self-discovery in the face of adversity.
Paul Martinez shares his experiences with late-life diagnoses of high-functioning autism and ADHD, revealing unique challenges in social interactions.
He discusses the lack of guidance during his tumultuous childhood, emphasizing survival strategies like 'fawning' to navigate family dynamics.
Joining the LDS Church provided Paul a sense of belonging and purpose, despite later struggles with its teachings and personal values.
The podcast explores the parallels between toxic relationships and church experiences, highlighting the importance of recognizing manipulative behaviors.
Paul emphasizes the necessity of processing grief from lost relationships and communities, advocating for vulnerability as a means of healing.
He advocates for cultivating meaningful connections in dating by prioritizing authenticity and curiosity over conventional expectations.
Deep dives
Navigating Neurodivergence
The episode discusses the challenges of navigating neurodivergence, particularly high-functioning autism and ADHD, within a high-demand religious context. The guest, Paul Martinez, shares personal insights on how these conditions manifest in social settings, emphasizing difficulties with impulse control, emotional regulation, and interpreting social cues. The discussion highlights how many individuals are receiving neurodivergent diagnoses later in life, prompting reflection on missed signs during childhood. This aspect of the conversation underscores the common experience of feeling out of place within structured environments, such as religious institutions.
Family Dynamics and Early Influences
Paul recounts the impact of his family dynamics on his early life, particularly highlighting the effects of having a father who exhibited signs of being on the spectrum. He describes a childhood marked by emotional volatility, a contentious divorce, and a significant lack of guidance. The importance of early survival techniques, such as 'fawning' to avoid conflict, is emphasized as a coping mechanism to navigate a challenging home environment. These experiences contributed to feelings of isolation and confusion, shaping Paul's self-identity and interpersonal relationships.
The Role of the Church in Personal Growth
Joining the church provided Paul with a sense of belonging and direction during a tumultuous time in his life. His conversion led to newfound relationships, purpose, and a structure that helped to fill the void left by his upbringing. The faith journey also instilled in him values of community involvement, which translated into leadership positions within the church. However, as his understanding deepened, the initial support he received gave way to complex feelings about the church's teachings and the alignment with his personal values.
Understanding Emotional Responses
The podcast explores the difficulty Paul faced in understanding and expressing emotions, a challenge common among individuals with neurodivergent traits. He explains the disconnect he often felt when trying to interpret others' emotions and social cues, which led to misinterpretations and frustration in both personal and social contexts. The conversation pivots to the importance of therapy and mindfulness in recognizing and processing these emotions. With time, Paul learned that acknowledging one's feelings is vital to fostering healthy relationships and self-acceptance.
Identifying Toxic Relationships
Paul discusses the parallels between abusive relationships and the experiences within the church, noting how both can exert control over individuals. Identifying signs of toxicity became crucial for Paul as he navigated friendships and romantic relationships in his adult life. He emphasizes the need to recognize behaviors such as manipulation, guilt, and emotional neglect as markers of an unhealthy relationship. This awareness has been instrumental in helping him establish boundaries and prioritize his mental well-being.
The Healing Power of Grief
Throughout the episode, grief emerges as a recurring theme, particularly in relation to the loss of his faith community and the end of his marriage. Paul explains that processing grief is essential for healing and moving forward, stating that embracing vulnerability through crying and reflection allows for growth. He emphasizes the importance of acknowledging that grief should not be suppressed and that recognizing its presence can lead to deeper self-awareness. This understanding has facilitated his journey toward rebuilding his identity outside of the church and past relationships.
Overcoming Loneliness
Loneliness, a byproduct of leaving the church and an abusive relationship, is addressed as a significant challenge by Paul. The discussion highlights the misconception that being alone equates to being lonely, and how learning to appreciate solitude has been vital to his journey. Paul expresses that it is possible to find fulfillment and joy when focusing on self-discovery and building meaningful connections. This realization has empowered him to navigate life independently and embrace new experiences.
Embracing Authenticity in Dating
Paul shares his experiences with dating as a newly single individual, emphasizing a more open and authentic approach. He describes using curiosity as a guiding principle, allowing for genuine connections without the pressure of expectations. This shift in mindset has fostered healthy conversations, encouraging both him and his dates to explore each other's stories and values. By prioritizing meaningful interactions over traditional dating ideals, Paul has found the process to be enriching and enjoyable.
Learning and Growth After Leaving
As Paul reflects on his journey after leaving the church, he acknowledges the personal growth and insights gained from the experience. The process of disentangling himself from ingrained beliefs and expectations has been both challenging and transformative. Paul discusses the importance of slowing down, acknowledging the lessons learned, and applying newfound knowledge to his current life. This reflective approach has enabled him to navigate life with increased confidence and awareness, becoming a more resilient individual.
Identifying and Navigating New Relationships
The podcast highlights the importance of identifying red flags and ensuring compatibility in new relationships. Paul shares strategies for assessing potential partners, focusing on behaviors that indicate respect, kindness, and emotional maturity. By recognizing the qualities he values most in a partner, he can better avoid individuals with toxic traits. This newfound awareness has empowered Paul to make more informed decisions and foster healthier relationships moving forward.
Reclaiming Personal Power and Identity
The conversation culminates in the theme of reclaiming personal power after distancing oneself from both the church and unhealthy relationships. Paul expresses how crucial it has been to reconnect with his identity and embrace the lessons learned throughout his journey. He finds strength in acknowledging the challenging experiences, ultimately seeing them as integral to his personal evolution. This sense of empowerment fosters hope, as Paul looks forward to continuing his journey of self-discovery and connection.
Paul reflects on his journey from being raised in the Mormon church to eventually leaving it. He opens up about his childhood, feeling isolated due to his neurodivergence, and his complicated relationship with his family. Paul shares his path to Mormonism, how he felt a strong connection to the faith at first, and his experiences as a missionary, including the challenges he faced in Argentina. Over time, he became disillusioned with the church, particularly after learning new information and struggling with its stance on LGBTQ issues. As Paul navigates life post-church, he discusses his career, his evolving understanding of love and relationships, and the healing process through music and self-reflection. The episode explores his feelings of loneliness, the importance of recognizing toxic behavior, and his journey to self-acceptance after leaving the Mormon faith.
00:14:30 Religious experiences before the LDS church
00:27:18 First introduction to Morminsim
00:47:28 Mission call to Buenos Aires and being pressured to confess sexual sins
01:00:55 How neurodivergence played into his mission
01:16:28 Parental alienation & trying to reconnect with his mom
01:32:58 “Mormonism is passive aggressive”
01:41:25 Paul began to get in trouble for questioning priesthood holders
01:59:20 November 2015 LGBT policy and Paul’s choice to stop attending church
02:14:50 Feeling love from the members, but not the institution
02:28:25 Narcissists only see their own reality
02:44:10 Do you feel more fulfilled than when you were Mormon?
02:56:04 Final questions - “Where will you go?”
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