Can you heal pain by focusing on joy? 

Baratunde Thurston gave what’s been called “the greatest TED talk of all time.” He’s written about being Black in America, he’s got a podcast about community involvement called How to Citizen, and he’s got a PBS television show that explores the beauty and diversity of America. 

There’s a duality running through all of this work, and in Baratunde’s personal life: mourning and celebration. From the early death of a parent, to men’s emotional health, to violence against Black men and boys, to the healing power of play and community, this week’s episode is a fascinating discussion of both grief and celebration - and why you don’t get one without the other. 

In this episode we cover: 

• Baratunde says he’s “wired for optimism” - which makes identifying his own grief… complicated
• How you can lose a parent at a young age and not recognize the impact until you’re an adult
• Why seeing other people be good parents can bring up grief
• Black joy and men’s community (plus the hashtag #BlackMenFrolicking)
• Why is it hard to play as an adult - and find other adults to play with? 

We're re-releasing some of our favorite episodes from the first 3 seasons. This episode was originally recorded in 2023.

Looking for a creative exploration of grief? Check out the best selling Writing Your Grief course here.

About our guest:

Baratunde Thurston is an Emmy-nominated, multi-platform storyteller and producer operating at the intersection of race, tech, democracy, and climate. He is the host of the PBS television series America Outdoors with Baratunde Thurston, creator and host of How To Citizen with Baratunde, and a founding partner of the new media startup Puck. His comedic memoir, How To Be Black, is a New York Times best-seller. Baratunde serves on the boards of BUILD.org and the Brooklyn Public Library. 

Find him at baratunde.com and follow him on social media @baratunde

About Megan: 

Psychotherapist Megan Devine is one of today’s leading experts on grief, from life-altering losses to the everyday grief that we don’t call grief. Get the best-selling book on grief in over a decade, It’s Ok that You’re Not OK, wherever you get books. Find Megan @refugeingrief

Additional resources:

Read Baratunde’s book - How to be Black 

Baratunde’s TED talk How to Deconstruct Racism, One Headline at a Time 
‘America is addicted to watching me die…’ - Baratunde’s Puck article "Thoughts & Tears For Tyre" 

Baratunde mentioned Valarie Kaur - get her book, See No Stranger, and listen to her episode on It’s OK that You’re Not OK

Want to talk with Megan directly? Join our patreon community for live monthly Q&A grief clinics: your questions, answered. Want to speak to her privately? Apply for a 1:1 grief consultation here. 

Check out Megan’s best-selling books - It’s OK That You're Not OK and How to Carry What Can’t Be Fixed

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