Deconstruction has become a polarized term in the past few years. Added to the arsenal of pastors and church leaders, it’s most often used to to dismiss or demean those who have walked away from their church, or to stoke fear into the hearts and spirits of those asking hard questions.

What was once a word meant to invite conversation or to indicate an desire to learn more and grow deeper has been weaponized.

There is little that it sexy about deconstruction. It’s difficult work, and requires courage and humility. And according to research, most who are deconstructing aren’t walking away from their faith, they’re on the way to deepening and strengthening it.

In this conversation with Scot McKnight and Tommy Phillips, we discuss why so many have left the church in search of the Jesus they hear talked about but don’t see in their own churches. We talk about why theology is a cover for leaving, individuating and spiritual formation, and much more.

Get the full show notes and links here. 📄

Guest Spotlight
Scot has been a professor of NT for more than four decades. He is the author of more than 90 books, including the award-winning The Jesus Creed as well as A Church Called TOV.

Tommy Preson Phillips is a pastor at Watermark Church in Tampa, FL. He is also a songwriter and recording artist with his band Preson Phillips. He holds an MA in NT from Northern Seminary.

Scot: Website | Instagram | Twitter/X | Threads

Tommy: Substack | Instagram | Threads |

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Come and discover a safe and compassionate community of fellow survivors and advocates. If you’re looking for practical tools to help process the pain and trauma of spiritual abuse, this is the event for you.

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Episode 32: KILL BILLies, Vol. 1