This conversation with Jed Sundwall, Executive Director of Radiant Earth, starts with a simple but crucial distinction: the difference between data and data products. And that distinction matters more than you might think.

We dig into why so many open data portals feel like someone just threw up a bunch of files and called it a day. Sure, the data's technically "open," but is it actually useful? Jed argues we need to be way more precise with our language and intentional about what we're building.

A data product has documentation, clear licensing, consistent formatting, customer support, and most importantly - it'll actually be there tomorrow.

From there, we explore Source Cooperative, which Jed describes as "object storage for people who should never log into a cloud console." It's designed to be invisible infrastructure - the kind you take for granted because it just works. We talk about cloud native concepts, why object storage matters, and what it really means to think like a product manager when publishing data.

The conversation also touches on sustainability - both the financial kind (how do you keep data products alive for 50 years?) and the cultural kind (why do we need organizations designed for the 21st century, not the 20th?). Jed introduces this idea of "gazelles" - smaller, lighter-weight institutions that can move together and actually get things done.

We wrap up talking about why shared understanding matters more than ever, and why making data easier to access and use might be one of the most important things we can do right now.

Podcasting for high school teachers