Carah Burrell joins Radio Free Mormon in critiquing a talk by apologist Steve Densley on proving the truth of the church, highlighting the lack of evidence and burden shifting. They explore historical figures, the challenges of testimony versus historical facts, uncertainty in religious beliefs, and manipulation within religious institutions. The conversation delves into accountability, belief in religion, and a casual chat about Greece trip details.
Belief doesn't equate to proof of truth in Mormonism.
Lack of evidence leads to rhetorical evasion in apologetics.
Book of Mormon's veracity remains unproven.
Apologists construct weak arguments akin to 'log cabins'.
Belief may lead to perceived confirmation without empirical evidence.
Shifting beliefs require evidence, not desire-driven changes.
Deep dives
Belief Elevated to Knowledge
People often claim to know the church is true based on personal experiences, teachings alignment with beliefs, and leaders' divine authority, but these do not constitute proof of truth.
Unwinnable Jury
Steve Dinsley argues that the inability to prove or disprove the church's truth results in a draw or a hung jury, presenting a rhetorical strategy of sidestepping the need for concrete evidence.
Hugh Nibley's Concession
Even staunch apologists like Hugh Nibley acknowledge that the evidence to prove or disprove the Book of Mormon does not exist, highlighting the insurmountable challenge in substantiating Mormonism.
Building a Log Cabin
Steve Densley's approach mirrors that of a lawyer constructing a weak argument, akin to 'building a log cabin,' where the emphasis is on generating belief rather than engaging with compelling evidence.
Desire as Proof
Dinsley's premise implies that belief serves as a pathway to proof—suggesting that wanting to believe in the church's truth can pave the way for a perceived confirmation, sidestepping the need for empirical substantiation.
The Podcast explores the concept of evidence changing beliefs
Evidence and convictions are pivotal in altering beliefs as highlighted in the narrative. The emphasis is on evidence-based shifts rather than desire-driven changes in opinions.
Analogies to Illustrate Conviction and Proof
Analogies like trusting eating out despite risks and cross-examinations in court underline the complexity of proving beliefs. The podcast navigates through analogies to draw parallels between faith, convictions, and legal scrutiny.
Challenging the idea of Conviction as Proof
The discussion highlights the challenge of equating convictions with proof, underscoring the need for critical examination of beliefs. It delves into the nuances of convictions and proofs in evaluating faith claims.
Addressing Doubts and Convictions
The narrative probes into the reasons behind disbelief despite evidence, prompting reflection on the nature of convictions and doubts. It explores the dichotomy between staying steadfast in beliefs and questioning them.
Analyzing Religions' Use of Tools to Maintain Belief
High-demand religions often utilize tools like ambiguous statements, faith reinforcement, and reliance on authority figures to keep followers entrenched in their faith. These 'wooden tools' serve as deceptive measures to deter critical thinking and promote blind faith, hindering individuals from questioning the validity of their beliefs.
Examining the Concept of Fruits and Convictions in Religious Faith
The discussion delves into the notion of 'fruits' in religious convictions, highlighting how believers may selectively interpret outcomes to affirm their faith. By attributing positive outcomes from faith-based living to the truthfulness of their beliefs, individuals may overlook critical evaluation and rely on subjective experiences as evidence for their convictions.
Radio Free Mormon sits down with Carah “Nuance Hoe” Burrell and they tackle a talk given by apologist and Densley in 2023 titled “Proving the Church is True”. Densley who also happens to be a lawyer and refers to such as the basis for how he designed his talk is about to get a lesson in law from yours truly, RFM !
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