With the deadly mercenary organization Wagner Group playing a key role in the Ukraine war, Justin and John sit down with Catrina Doxsee, associate director and associate fellow for the Transnational Threats Project at the Center for Strategic and International Studies (CSIS).

Catrina explains Wagner's opaque structure and murky dealings in countries from Mali and Madagascar to Ukraine. She describes the rise of Yevgeny Prigozhin from a restaurant owner to global mass murderer, evaluating his ties to Vladmir Putin and his agenda in openly mocking Russia's military elite.

More from Catrina here: https://www.csis.org/people/catrina-doxsee