Very Bad Wizards

Episode 277: The Merits of Buggery (Nagel's "Sexual Perversion")

Jan 30, 2024

Podcast explores Thomas Nagel's surprising essay on sexual perversion and the nature of sexual desires. Discussion includes a new study on attitudes about sexual assault with sex robots. The hosts analyze Nagel's arguments against the notion of perversion and explore the complexities of hunger and sexual desire. They also discuss the concept of desire, the role of fantasy in sexual desire, and whether engaging in non-traditional sexual activities qualifies as perversion.

01:35:32

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Quick takeaways

Sexual desire is a relational experience that goes beyond perceiving someone's embodiment, emphasizing the importance of mutual recognition and embodiment in shaping natural and non-perverse interactions.

Sexual perversion exists when desire deviates from the relational and reciprocal nature, but determining what qualifies as a perversion is complex and subjective, influenced by individual preferences, societal norms, and ongoing debates around sexual ethics.

Nagel draws on Sartre's ideas to argue for the complexity of sexual attraction and the subjective nature of desire in his account of sexual perversion, exemplified through an analysis of erotic fiction involving Romeo and Juliet.

Deep dives

The Complexity of Sexual Desire

Nagel explores the multifaceted nature of sexual desire, highlighting its significance in human relationships and interactions.

Defining Sexual Perversion

01:02

Desire as Arousing and Reciprocal

01:48

Introduction

2min

Barbie's Surprising Oscar Nomination

4min

Attitudes towards Sexual Assault and Blame

17min

Challenges in Writing a Morality Paper and Future Implications for Sex Robots

3min

Exploring Sexual Perversion and Consent, with a Touch of Humor

4min

Analyzing Thomas Nagel's Essay on Sexual Perversion

16min

Strange Opening Line and Lack of Cross-Cultural Studies on Sexual Assault

2min

The Complexity of Hunger and Sexual Desire

21min

Citations of Jesus and Paul in relation to sexual desire and perversion

5min

10.

Exploring the Concept of Perversion and Desire

5min

11.

Exploring Sexual Perversion and Fantasy

17min

David and Tamler play the old hits – Thomas Nagel and sex robots. In the main segment we talk about Nagel’s essay “Sexual Perversion”, a surprising essay on many fronts (Sartre, erotic fiction, conceptual analysis, much more). What’s the nature of sexual desires? Can we say that some sexual interactions are perversions? Which ones? Can we have a perverse form of a hunger? Plus, a new study examines attitudes about sexual assault by probing for intuitions on assaulting sex robots. It gets more confusing from there.

Links:

Grigoreva, A. D., Rottman, J., & Tasimi, A. (2024). When does “no” mean no? Insights from sex robots. Cognition, 244, 105687.

Nagel, T. (1969). Sexual perversion. The Journal of Philosophy, 5-17.