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Facing AI Doom, Lessons from Daniel Ellsberg (Pentagon Papers) — Michael Ellsberg

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Nov 29, 2025

Guest

Michael Ellsberg

Michael Ellsberg, author and commentator, is the son of Pentagon Papers leaker Daniel Ellsberg. He dives into alarming parallels between the Vietnam War and today's AI arms race. Michael posits a staggering 99% probability of doom, sharing his personal experience of being replaced by AI. He emphasizes the moral duty of tech insiders to disclose risks and critiques the economic implications of AI on jobs. The discussion covers everything from nuclear near-misses to the psychological toll of existential risks, wrapping up with a call for responsible action against AI threats.

02:15:50

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ADVICE

Insiders Must Warn The Public

If you work at a top AI lab and internal estimates show much greater danger than leadership admits, warn the public.
Prioritize public safety over corporate loyalty, even at personal cost.

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INSIGHT

Nuclear Trade-Offs Mirror AI Choices

Daniel Ellsberg saw nuclear planning trade-offs as analogous to today's AI decisions about superintelligence.
The moral stakes are similar: decisions now can determine survival for future generations.

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ANECDOTE

Leaking The Pentagon Papers

Daniel Ellsberg photocopied the 7,000-page Pentagon Papers and gave them to the New York Times.
The leak revealed how the public had been lied into escalating the Vietnam War.

Get the Snipd Podcast app to discover more snips from this episode

Who Was Daniel Ellsberg and the Pentagon Papers

01:30 • 3min

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Daniel Ellsberg's 'Doomsday Machine' Origins

04:18 • 1min

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Moral Duty to Blow the Whistle

05:22 • 41sec

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Parallels: Vietnam Lies and AI Secrecy

06:02 • 2min

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Why Leaders Persist in Bad Wars or Tech Races

08:26 • 3min

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Civil Disobedience and Nonviolent Resistance

11:08 • 2min

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Publishing the Archives and Continued Dissent

13:13 • 7min

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The Doomsday Machine: Delegation Risks

19:56 • 9min

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Nuclear Near-Misses and Systemic Insanity

Mutually Assured Destruction Myths

39:45 • 10min

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ASI as a Super-Virus and Replicator Dynamics

49:50 • 5min

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Temporal Selection and Replicator Attractors

55:11 • 15min

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What's Your P(doom)? Michael's 99%

01:10:18 • 5min

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Liron's P(doom) and Why He Hesitates

01:15:02 • 8min

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Michael's Path to AI Doomerism

01:22:45 • 4min

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AI Unemployment: Copywriting and Creative Work

01:26:26 • 6min

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AI Music Turing Test and Cultural Loss

01:32:46 • 7min

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Doom Psychology and Living with Existential Risk

01:39:23 • 7min

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Economic Collapse, UBI, and Disempowerment Risks

01:46:49 • 4min

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Mainline Doom: Multipolar Arms Race

01:51:04 • 4min

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Aligned Singleton Risk: The Joyless Singularity

01:55:30 • 14min

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Daniel Ellsberg's Core Lesson for AI Insiders

• Mentioned in 21 episodes

The Mating Mind

How Sexual Choice Shaped the Evolution of Human Nature

Geoffrey Miller

In 'The Mating Mind,' Geoffrey Miller proposes that the human mind evolved not just as a survival machine but as a courtship machine. He argues that many of the distinctive human traits, such as language, art, music, and morality, were developed as fitness indicators and sexual attractors. Miller draws on Darwin's theory of sexual selection and integrates ideas from psychology, economics, history, and pop culture to explain how these traits were shaped by the sexual choices of our ancestors. The book suggests that once language evolved, thought itself became subject to sexual selection, and that human courtship is a primary driving force behind human evolution.

#68008

The Education of Millionaires

Everything You Won't Learn in College About How to Be Successful

Michael Ellsberg

The Education of Millionaires challenges the conventional wisdom that a college degree is necessary for success. It emphasizes the importance of practical skills such as marketing, sales, and networking, and features interviews with successful entrepreneurs who achieved success without traditional academic credentials. The book provides actionable advice on how to build a personal brand, find mentors, and invest in oneself for success.

#582

• Mentioned in 44 episodes

Nuclear War

A Scenario

Annie Jacobsen

In 'Nuclear War: A Scenario', Annie Jacobsen presents a meticulously researched and chilling scenario of a nuclear war. The book begins with a surprise nuclear attack by North Korea on the United States, triggering a cascade of events that involve multiple nations and lead to catastrophic consequences. Jacobsen draws on exclusive interviews with military and civilian experts, as well as recently declassified government reports, to outline the minute-by-minute unfolding of a nuclear conflict. The book highlights the dangers of the 'Launch on Warning' policy, the inadequacy of current nuclear defenses, and the devastating impact on global civilization, including the immediate destruction, long-term environmental damage, and the eventual collapse of societal structures. Jacobsen's work serves as a call to action for disarmament and a stark reminder of the existential threat posed by nuclear weapons.

#14983

• Mentioned in 3 episodes

Secrets

Deepak Chopra

#55502

Truth and consequences

How Colleges and Universities Meet Public Crises

Jerrold K. Footlick

A chapter of this book is dedicated to assessing how the University of Utah administration handled the cold fusion controversy.

#3837

• Mentioned in 10 episodes

The Doomsday Machine

Confessions of a Nuclear War Planner

Daniel Ellsberg

In this book, Daniel Ellsberg chronicles his experiences as a nuclear war planner during the Cold War, revealing shocking details about the delegation of authority to initiate nuclear attacks, secret plans for general nuclear war, and the precarious nature of nuclear strategy. The book is divided into two parts: the first part is a memoir/confession of Ellsberg's intellectual and moral evolution, while the second part adopts a more academic perspective, analyzing the principles of 'just war' policy and the consequences of nuclear exchanges. Ellsberg argues that little has changed in nuclear policy since the Eisenhower and Kennedy years and offers feasible steps to dismantle the 'doomsday machine' and avoid nuclear catastrophe.

Michael Ellsberg, son of the legendary Pentagon Papers leaker Daniel Ellsberg, joins me to discuss the chilling parallels between his father’s nuclear war warnings and today’s race to AGI.

We discuss Michael’s 99% probability of doom, his personal experience being “obsoleted” by AI, and the urgent moral duty for insiders to blow the whistle on AI’s outsize risks.

Timestamps

0:00 Intro

1:29 Introducing Michael Ellsberg, His Father Daniel Ellsberg, and The Pentagon Papers

5:49 Vietnam War Parallels to AI: Lies and Escalation

25:23 The Doomsday Machine & Nuclear Insanity

48:49 Mutually Assured Destruction vs. Superintelligence Risk

55:10 Evolutionary Dynamics: Replicators and the End of the “Dream Time”

1:10:17 What’s Your P(doom)?™

1:14:49 Debating P(Doom) Disagreements

1:26:18 AI Unemployment Doom

1:39:14 Doom Psychology: How to Cope with Existential Risk

1:50:56 The “Joyless Singularity”: Aligned AI Might Still Freeze Humanity

2:09:00 A Call to Action for AI Insiders

Show Notes:

Michael Ellsberg’s website — https://www.ellsberg.com/

Michael’s Twitter — https://x.com/MichaelEllsberg

Daniel Ellsberg’s website — https://www.ellsberg.net/

The upcoming book, “Truth and Consequence” — https://geni.us/truthandconsequence

Michael’s AI-related substack “Mammalian Wetware” — https://mammalianwetware.substack.com/

Daniel’s debate with Bill Kristol in the run-up to the Iraq war — https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HyvsDR3xnAg

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