094 "Vengeance Is Mine," An Interview with Richard Turley and Barbara Jones Brown
Dec 17, 2024
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In this discussion, Richard Turley, a historian for the Latter-day Saints, and Barbara Jones Brown, Director at Signature Books, delve into their book, 'Vengeance is Mine'. They analyze the Mountain Meadows Massacre's grim legacy and the elaborate efforts to obscure the truth behind it. Key topics include the historical accountability of church leaders and the emotional journey of reconciliation with victims' descendants. They emphasize the importance of transparency, acknowledging past wrongs, and fostering healing within the community through truth-telling and collective remembrance.
The podcast emphasizes the efforts of church and civic leaders to obscure their involvement in the Mountain Meadows Massacre through misinformation and political maneuvering.
It highlights the complex legal aftermath where only John D. Lee faced execution among nine indicted individuals, reflecting a failure to hold broader culpability accountable.
The discussion also focuses on the importance of reconciliation initiatives, like quilt-making, which foster healing and connections between descendants of victims and perpetrators.
Deep dives
Concealment and Misinformation
The aftermath of the Mountain Meadows Massacre involved concerted efforts by church and civic leaders in southern Utah to obscure their involvement in the atrocity. This included silencing witnesses and spreading misinformation to evade accountability and stall investigations by both governmental and church authorities. Leaders employed various political maneuvers to sabotage potential inquiries and maintain a narrative that shifted blame away from themselves. Ultimately, numerous strategies were employed to protect those culpable while ensuring that public discourse surrounding the massacre remained muddied.
Tracing Accountability
The podcast delves into the legal repercussions following the massacre, revealing that out of the nine individuals indicted, only John D. Lee faced execution. Evidence suggested that Lee, along with several other local leaders, played a critical role in the events leading up to the tragedy but ultimately became the scapegoat for the larger group's actions. The complexities of the legal proceedings reflected a desire from federal authorities to hold accountable those in positions of power who directed the violence. Yet, due to a lack of concrete evidence and various political rivalries, many perpetrators avoided prosecution, leaving significant culpability unaddressed.
Linking Past and Present
The discussion emphasizes the importance of acknowledging historical injustices for healing and reconciliation. Both Turley and Brown highlighted the necessity for modern-day Latter-day Saints to come to terms with the massacre and express sorrow for the suffering inflicted upon the victims’ descendants. Engaging with the truth of past atrocities fosters a collective understanding and empathy that transcends generations. Educational efforts, such as public statements and memorial projects, have been fundamental in encouraging honest dialogues about the church's difficult histories.
Revisiting Histories
The podcast also explored the narratives constructed around the Mountain Meadows Massacre, particularly those used to justify the violence. Many claims made by perpetrators framed the victims as a threat, suggesting that they were involved in prior aggressions or wrongdoing. The hosts and guests debunked these myths, reinforcing that the evidence indicates that the Fancher-Baker party posed no real risk to the community. By critically analyzing these historical accounts, the conversation aimed to dismantle justifications for violence and ensure that the victims are remembered honorably.
Quilts of Reconciliation
An inspiring element of their discussion revolved around the creation of quilts representing reconciliation between descendants of massacre victims and church members. These quilts, symbolizing the threads of individual lives intertwined, serve as a reminder of the shared quest for healing and mutual understanding. Events surrounding their creation have fostered an environment where descendants of both victims and perpetrators can meet, reflect on the past, and establish connections built on shared stories. Such initiatives illustrate how acknowledging difficult histories can lead to repairing relationships and building a more inclusive community.
In May 2023 Richard Turley and Barbara Jones Brown published a book through Oxford University Press entitled Vengeance is Mine, which documents the aftermath of the Mountain Meadows Massacre, including the efforts of Church and civic leaders in southern Utah to conceal their involvement in the atrocity through witness silencing and misinformation, as well as evading or stalling investigations by both government agencies and church organizations by lack of cooperation and political maneuvering. They also chronicle details about the nine individuals who were ultimately indicted, the five who were apprehended, and John D. Lee, who ultimately faced execution.
In this episode of Church History Matters, we sit down with both Richard Turley and Barbara Jones Brown to discuss their important book, to hear their informed insights and perspectives, and to consider what Latter-day Saints and others can learn from this tragedy and how we can productively move forward.