Become a more effective team in this CTO podcast featuring Rebecca Murphey, Field CTO of Swarmia and co-author of Build. From her years of experience working in the developer productivity organizations at Stripe and Indeed and now at Swarmia, Rebecca knows this conversation isn’t just about developer metrics and productivity - it’s about the broader picture 🖼️. How do we align🧭 our engineering work with business outcomes💸, developer experience 😀AND developer productivity⚡. And just as important, how do we communicate what we’re doing (and not doing) to other stakeholders?

Listen to find out:

• 🔄 Queuing Theory as a paradigm for developer workflow evaluation
• ⏳ How to allocate time for different engineering tasks
• 👥 Team Metrics vs. 🧑‍💻 Individual Metrics
• 📊 Metrics: DORA, SPACE, BRAINs, and more
• ⚖️ The ethical debate on tracking developer metrics 🤔 If you optimize for the quarter, do you de-optimize for the future?

Listen here

About Rebecca Murphey

Rebecca is the Field CTO at Swarmia and the coauthor of Build: Elements of an Effective Software Organization. Prior to Swarmia, Rebecca worked in the developer productivity organizations at Stripe and Indeed.

About Swarmia

Swarmia

Swarmia is an engineering effectiveness platform for modern software organizations. Hundreds of data-driven companies from small startups to large enterprises use Swarmia to continuously improve across three key areas: business outcomes, developer productivity, and developer experience.

Swarmia connects with the tools your teams are already using: from source code hosting to your issue tracker and chat. With it, you'll stay on top of strategic initiatives, measure key engineering metrics (including DORA and SPACE), and drive continuous improvement in teams.

Learn more and start your free 14-day trial at https://link.alphalist.com/swarmia_podcast

Timestamps

(00:00) Introduction to Alphalist Podcast (00:57) Meet Rebecca Murphy: Field CTO at Swarmia (01:52) Exploring Engineering Effectiveness (04:12) TRENDS: Reason to focus on Why is developer productivity trending? (04:26) 1. Post-ZIRP (05:46) 2. Maturing software industry wants sustainable business models (06:16) 3. Push for simplicity (09:17) BUSINESS VALUE: Aligning with Developer Productivity and Experience (12:07) Queuing Theory: Predicting chaos in developer workflow (15:29) Issue with KTLO (16:07) DEVELOPER METRICS: Is there an ideal mix? (18:19) What is DORA (19:04) SPACE (21:35) Context: Surfacing actionability in metrics (24:44) The Role of Leadership in Productivity (27:21) Balancing Short-Term Desires with Long-Term Needs (28:43) Technical Debt in 4-person startup? Ignore. But hire right (29:54) Allocating Time for Different Engineering Tasks (31:09) Optimize for the quarter and you de-optimize for the future? (32:12) Ethical Debate about Developer Productivity Tools and Metrics (34:18) Team Metrics vs. Individual Metrics (36:12) Gaming metrics: bad or good? (37:32) Is it okay to measure engineers? (40:25) CTO's Role in Explaining Engineering to Non-Technical Peers (42:11) Tips for CTOs on Developer Productivity / Developer Experience (44:54) BRAINS Framework (48:56) Lesson to Younger Self: Engineering + Business

Quotes

• "We can work really fast on the wrong thing. But are we actually working on the thing that the business values? And so I think that's a really key part of the productivity conversation that maybe has been missing in the past is: Are we doing the right things?
• "The utility that an individual engineer can provide will decrease over time if you aren't tackling that constant increase in complexity."
• "I don't [know] how to make that message any easier to hear. It really is a question of “do you want to hit this quarter's goals, or do you want to have a sustainable business in two years?’ It's a constant balance between those. I think understanding that those two things are in tension and that *when you are just optimizing for the quarter, you are de-optimizing for the future. *Those two things need to be in balance so that you are continuing to create a sustainable environment for creating more value, right? An environment where you can keep creating value. If you are only creating value and not gardening the environment, then eventually you will not have an environment where you can create value. "