White Women Cry & Call Me Angry by Dr. Yanique Redwood with Jill Poklemba

In this episode, I’m joined by Jill Poklemba in an honest conversation inspired by Dr. Yanique Redwood’s White Women Cry & Call Me Angry. We get into the messy and uncomfortable realities of whiteness in social justice spaces—how it shows up in ways white people don’t always notice, and how terms like “progressive” can sometimes do more to mask internalized racism than reveal it. Jill and I explore the ways white women unintentionally use vulnerability as a way to deflect, making it harder to be called out and, ultimately, to become effective accomplices. We also talk about reclaiming real connection, breaking free from old, unhelpful roles like the “Rescuer” or “Victim,” and the deeper work of showing up fully for racial justice. If you’re a white person committed to dismantling racism, I hope this conversation will offer space for reflection, camaraderie, and inspiration. SHOW NOTES Earlier this year, I reached out to Dr. Yanique Redwood, racial justice strategist and author of White Women Cry & Call Me Angry, inviting her to join me on my podcast. Her personal recounting of the dismissals and hurt she experienced from White women in the philanthropy sector moved me, and I wanted my listeners to learn from her. She shared that she’s focused on supporting Black women now but asked if I’d be willing to talk with a White woman about her book—a mini-book club of sorts. I said yes, of course. This week’s episode with Jill Poklemba—development, public policy, and communications specialist with over twenty years in the social change field—emerged from there. If you’re a white person, grappling with how to do your part to dismantle racism, within yourself and in the world, I hope you’ll tune in. In this intimate conversation, we talk about: The trauma of becoming White and being separated (hundreds of years ago) from our indigeneity Why reclaiming relationship with each other is key to healing Why calling ourselves progressive can be a form of gaslighting How white women wield their vulnerability as a weapon to shut down criticism, and how this makes it harder to call us out The Rescue Triangle (Rescuer - Victim - Perpetrator) and how to get untrapped As well as all sorts of steps we can take to dismantle both internalized racism and systems of white supremacy out in the world. I hope you’ll listen. (And buy the book! White Women Cry & Call Me Angry.) And I hope (especially if you’re a white woman!) you’ll stay with me in the struggle. Because as former slave and civil rights leader Frederick Douglass wrote and Dr. Yanique Redwood shares in her book: “Those who profess to favor freedom and yet deprecate agitation are people who want crops without plowing the ground. They want rain without thunder and lightning. They want the ocean without the roar of its mighty waters. The struggle may be a moral one or it may be a physical one, or it may be both moral and physical, but it must be a struggle.” Bios Dr. Yanique Redwood is an author, speaker, racial justice strategist, and facilitator of intimate spaces that center care and connection among Black people and people of color. In August 2023, she self-published her first book White Women Cry and Call Me Angry: A Black Woman’s Memoir on Racism in Philanthropy. She is also the founder of Collective Work, a consultancy devoted to helping organizations answer the question: What liberatory practices can we collectively cultivate so that our strategy is powerfully and authentically executed? She lives in Washington, DC but spends most of her time in Montego Bay, Jamaica. Jill Poklemba has worked in public policy and human services for over 20 years, with the last 15+ years spent working for several different non-profit organizations in New York City, focusing on fundraising and communications. In that time, she has been driven by a focus on dismantling systems of oppression built by the culture of white supremacy that still dominates our society and replacing its core value system of exploitation and colonization with one that centers on healing and love. She also works toward building intersectional relationships with leaders in the field of philanthropy as means of re-directing resources to shift the power structure, lift up communities of color, and replace the culture of white supremacy with a value system that is rooted in a deep love of humanity. Links White Women Cry & Call Me Angry, Dr. Yanique Redwood Decolonizing Wealth, Edgar Villanueva Freedom is a Constant Struggle, Angela Y. Davis Nikole Hannah-Jones, The 1619 Project Liberated Capital Fund Soul Fire Farm Tema Okun - Characteristics of White Supremacy The Book on Fire - Caliban & the Witch Intro Episode