The podcast explores the structure of envy, its relationship to jealousy, and its political implications. They reference Othello and Seven as notable explorations of envy, while discussing its distinction from jealousy and its role in stealing others' enjoyment. The concept of kettle logic is explored, along with the psychological functioning of envy and its harmful effects. The importance of considering the human element in immigration and the factors contributing to envy towards the wealthy are also discussed.
Envy is driven by the act of taking away something from someone else, destroying their enjoyment.
Envy plays a unique role in capitalist societies, particularly with regards to wealth disparities.
Envy has the potential to be the basis for an emancipatory group by recognizing that everyone feels envy and the object of envy is not fully unattainable.
Deep dives
Envy as the Stealing of Enjoyment
Envy is described as the desire to steal the enjoyment of others. This is illustrated in the example of children fighting over a toy, where one child is not interested in playing with the toy but only wants to deprive the other child of their enjoyment. Envy is driven by the act of taking away something from someone else, thus destroying their enjoyment.
The Complex Nature of Envy
Envy is a complex emotion that is difficult to articulate. It is often unconscious and unacceptable, leading to difficulties in explaining its existence. The comparison between jealousy and envy is explored, emphasizing how envy seeks to destroy the enjoyment of others, rather than desiring the object directly. The psychological implications of envy, such as the satisfaction derived from depriving others of their enjoyment, are also highlighted.
Envy and Wealth Disparities
Envy plays a unique role in capitalist societies, particularly with regards to wealth disparities. While the marginalized and poor are often envied for their perceived enjoyment, the wealthy are not typically subjected to envy in the same way. It is suggested that this may be due to a deferential attitude towards the wealthy, as well as a lack of interest or recognition of their extravagant lifestyles. The external figure of poverty, which is envied by the wealthy, is explored as a necessary component for the functioning of capitalism.
Envy as a Divisive Emotion
Envy is identified as a fundamentally divisive emotion that can lead to destructive actions. The speaker highlights the lynching as an extreme example of people coming together through the envy of another's enjoyment, resulting in exclusion and destruction. Envy creates an us vs them dynamic, where the bond formed is based on exclusion and the desire to destroy what is envied.
Envy and the Formation of Emancipatory Groups
The possibility of envy being the basis for an emancipatory group is explored. The speaker suggests that an emancipatory collective could form around the idea that nobody has the thing that is envied, inverting envy. This means recognizing that everyone feels envy and that the object of envy is not fully closed-off or unattainable. By accepting the symbolic castration and embracing this inverted form of envy, an emancipatory group could be formed.
Ryan and Todd discuss the structure of envy, its relationship to jealousy, and its political implications. They make reference to Othello and Seven as landmark explorations of envy, while also noting its relationship with the other deadly sins.
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