Mormon Stories Podcast
My Mormon Truth Crisis as an Attorney - Justin Sweeney | Ep. 1989
Episode guests
Podcast summary created with Snipd AI
Quick takeaways
- Justin Sweeney distinguishes between a 'truth crisis' and a 'faith crisis', emphasizing the impact of revealed truths on beliefs.
- Reflecting on his background, Justin shares how commitment to church leadership led to increased personal questioning of core doctrines.
- His exploration of polygamy and Joseph Smith's practices reveals contradictions that challenge the integrity of church teachings.
- Justin learns of the Masonic origins of the temple ceremony, causing him to reevaluate its significance and authenticity in his faith.
- He expresses concern over the church's selective retelling of history, which can lead to disillusionment when uncomfortable truths are eventually discovered.
- Prioritizing open dialogues with his family, Justin aims to create a supportive environment for exploring beliefs amidst their evolving relationship with the church.
Deep dives
Introduction to a Truth Crisis
The conversation begins with Justin Sweeney's experience of grappling with the notion of a 'truth crisis' rather than a 'faith crisis.' He discusses how the Book of Mormon defines faith in truth, suggesting that a crisis of faith can arise when truths about the church or its teachings are revealed. Sweeney emphasizes that faith should align with reality, and when confronted with conflicting information, individuals may question the validity of their beliefs. The discussion establishes that the exploration of truth can lead to significant shifts in one's understanding of faith.
Personal Background and Church Leadership
Justin shares insights into his background as a stake high councilman and immigration attorney, providing insight into his previous high-level leadership role within the Mormon church. His church journey began with a strong family connection to the faith, with parents and grandparents who actively practiced Mormonism. Justin expresses his dedication to the church through years of service, leadership calls, and personal growth, emphasizing the high expectations placed on him as the eldest in his family. Despite his longstanding commitment, he acknowledges that his perspective has shifted as he has begun to question fundamental beliefs.
Questioning the Church's Teachings
Justin reflects on his questioning of the church's teachings, particularly regarding polygamy and its origins. He discusses the conflicting narratives surrounding Joseph Smith's practice of plural marriage, highlighting the church's historical reluctance to address these issues directly. Through research and conversations, he discovers the contradictions in the church's explanations of polygamy, leading him to question the integrity of their teachings. This realization marks a pivotal moment in his journey toward understanding the truth of his faith and the teachings he had accepted for so long.
The Masonic Connection
The discussion moves to the connection between the temple ceremony and Freemasonry, addressing how many aspects of the endowment can be traced back to Masonic rituals. Justin expresses his discomfort upon learning that the temple ceremony is derived from Masonic practices, challenging everything he has been taught about its sacredness and authenticity. He identifies this revelation as both enlightening and troubling, prompting him to reevaluate his previous understanding of the temple. This exploration reveals how the temple has been a central aspect of his faith and now serves as a point of contention he must navigate.
The Role of the Church in Truth
The conversation highlights the church's approach to truth and the perceived need to sanitize its narrative for members. Justin discusses the implications of a selective retelling of church history, where uncomfortable truths about Joseph Smith's actions and the church's policies are omitted or downplayed. He emphasizes that this dishonest presentation of history can lead to deeper disillusionment among members when they inevitably discover the truth. The church's efforts to promote an idealized image are seen as detrimental to its members' understanding and faith.
Impact of Doctrine and Teachings
Justin acknowledges how the church's doctrines, particularly regarding eternal families and the role of women, complicate his relationship with the faith. He questions the implications of the church's teachings about women as second-class citizens within a patriarchal structure, especially given the narratives surrounding historical polygamy. The way these doctrines are presented causes deep internal conflict regarding gender roles and the equity of relationships within a faith context. His reflections illustrate the challenges faced by members as they reconcile love for their faith with its teachings that may not align with modern values of equality.
Navigating Identity and Belief
As Justin further explores his beliefs, he contemplates how his identity is intertwined with his Mormon upbringing. He expresses gratitude for the positive aspects of his experiences within the church but acknowledges the weight of disparity between the truth and the narratives he was taught. With a family heavily invested in church culture, he grapples with the fear of losing that connection if he fully disassociates. This conflict leads him to adopt a nuanced stance where he continues to navigate his identity as a member but is increasingly aware of the inconsistencies within the church's claims.
The Complexity of Community
Justin describes the comfort that the church community provides, despite the unraveling of his beliefs. He recognizes the challenges of confronting family dynamics as he processes his truth-seeking journey while maintaining relationships with family and friends who are still deeply connected to the church. The value of community brings about a desire to remain active, albeit with increasing nuance in his engagement. Balancing these realities becomes a complex task for Justin as he weighs honesty against potential backlash from the community he has been part of for years.
Maintaining Open Conversations
In his current approach, Justin prioritizes transparent conversations with his family about truth, faith, and the church's complex history. He aims to foster an environment where his children can ask questions and explore their beliefs without fear of judgment or reprisal. This commitment to honesty is aimed at equipping his children with the knowledge needed to navigate their own spiritual journeys. Thus, he intends to support their autonomy in understanding what they believe and helping them to make informed decisions.
Confronting the Future
The discussion continues with Justin pondering what the future holds for him and his family amid their evolving relationship with the church. While he acknowledges that leaving the church could provide freedom from internal conflict, he is also aware of the emotional implications that come with such a decision. The desire to maintain familial relationships, provide stability, and respect his children's choices remain paramount in his decision-making process. Justin expresses that ultimately, he hopes to support his family in finding happiness and fulfillment, regardless of the path they choose.
Finding Value in Critical Thinking
Through his experiences, Justin underscores the importance of critical thinking when it comes to faith and beliefs. He recognizes how applying a lawyer's analytical mindset has significantly influenced his understanding of church history and its teachings, empowering him to seek out the truth. This newfound perspective allows him to differentiate between faith as a construct and truth as an objective reality. He advocates for valuing evidence-based belief systems and encourages others to embrace this critical approach to their own understanding of spirituality.
A Call for Truth and Transparency
In wrapping up his thoughts, Justin emphasizes the significant gap between the church's public narrative and the factual history that has emerged. He urges that for the church to remain relevant and meaningful, it must embrace transparency and authenticity in its teachings. By separating cultural narratives from historical truth, a more integrated and honest community can thrive. This call to action is rooted in the hope for an inclusive space for belief where individuals are met with love, respect, and truth rather than fear of consequences.
In today's episode, John sits down for a conversation with immigration attorney, Justin Sweeney. Justin grew up LDS in Mesa, AZ, served a mission in Argentina, and has served in many leadership positions within the church. He was even serving in his branch presidency up until the end of 2024. Justin discusses how he felt overworked in his church callings, questioning polygamy and masonry, and his journey of discovering the true history of the church.
00:01:20 Justin’s experience with a “Truth Crisis” not “Faith Crisis” and Intentions
00:14:43 Growing up, High School, and sports
00:26:17 Justin’s experience at the MTC
00:36:35 “Fraudulent” baptisms in Latin American missions
00:40:55 Being called to YSA bishopric
00:53:47 Justing finishing law school & became immigration attorney
01:09:57 Justin began to feel like an outsider from mormonism
01:18:00 Discussion about the Godmakers and the lack of women in the Eternal Plan
01:25:15 Justin Sweeney’s “Truth crisis” begins
01:39:30 Justin was “using his lawyer brain to asses Mormonism”
01:44:50 Learning about the “stone in the hat” and that the church still has it
01:55:00 Comparing Mormonism to Santa Claus
02:05:33 Women are second class people in Mormonism
02:10:52 Justin discussing the LDS SEC order from an attorney’s perspective
02:23:00 Reading Second Class Saints by Matt Harris with his wife and kids
02:26:20 Why not keep it to himself and continue to “fake it”
02:32:25 “My intention is not to tell people to leave the church”
02:38:47 Elder Holland “stay in the boat” marketing video
02:44:35 Why isn't he afraid of excommunication by coming on Mormon Stories?
02:54:09 Final thoughts - Is he happier now no longer believing?
Mormon Stories Thanks Our Generous Donors!
Help us continue to deliver quality content by becoming a donor today:
Our Platforms:
Contact us:
MormonStories@gmail.com
PO Box 171085, Salt Lake City, UT 84117
Social Media:
Remember Everything You Learn from Podcasts
