A survey of people incarcerated in California found that 20 percent of women in for homicide had killed their abusive partners. How have self-defense laws failed women in abusive relationships—and how can they be reformed to save lives?

Guest: Rachel Louise Snyder, journalist, author of No Visible Bruises: What We Don’t Know About Domestic Violence Can Kill Us, and professor at American University.

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Podcast production by Elena Schwartz, Paige Osburn, Anna Phillips, Madeline Ducharme and Rob Gunther.

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What Next | Why Women Kill