It's rare that I end an interview on the brink of tears, but this was such a powerful interview with former ANC MP Andrew Feinstein. He tells me his family history of surviving the Holocaust - unlike so many of his relatives - and how this informed his struggle against Apartheid.
But he tells me why Israel's oppression of the Palestinians is worse than Apartheid, why the anti-apartheid movement is an example to now follow, the silencing of pro-Palestinian voices, South Africa's case against Israel alleging genocide - and why history shows we have a responsibility to speak out.
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The Owen Jones Podcast