Abby and Patrick welcome writer and scholar Jordan Stein to tackle a fundamental psychoanalytic concept that’s also a fundamentally slippery one: fantasy. What, exactly, are these things we call “fantasies,” which arise in a liminal zone between what we consciously, intentionally imagine and what seems to come to us, unbidden, from the unconscious? How do fantasies straddle the gaps between the real world as we understand it, scenarios we know to be impossible, and things we try, nonetheless, to envision otherwise? How is fantasy different from desire? And above all, how what does fantasy reflect our understandings of other people, living or dead, whom we may “know” only via the popular imagination, as cultural figures, and yet who come to play crucial roles in our own self-fashioning and navigation of life events? Jordan’s wonderful new book, Fantasies of Nina Simone, offers a perfect springboard for pursuing these questions, while also casting new light on the biography, oeuvre, and legacy of an artist whose ability to give literal voice to so many different characters and fantasies has few other parallels in twentieth century music. Abby, Patrick, and Jordan’s conversation ranges widely through Simone’s work, from her classic songbook standards to her transformational covers of singers as from Bob Dylan to Sinatra to the Bee Gees, and explores what we know, and what we can only fantasize about, her personal transformations, political engagements, and singular expressions of joy, loneliness, yearning, and so much more.

Books by Jordan Alexander Stein: Fantasies of Nina Simone, Avidly Reads Theory, When Novels Were Books.

A Spotify playlist for Fantasies of Nina Simone is available at: https://open.spotify.com/playlist/6QUnsR5Pl8qbQ1jzqYLb0a

Have you noticed that Freud is back? Got questions about psychoanalysis? Or maybe you’ve traversed the fantasy and lived to tell the tale? Leave us a voicemail! (646) 450-0847

A podcast about psychoanalysis, politics, pop culture, and the ways we suffer now. New episodes on Saturdays. Follow us on social media:

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CZM Book Club: How to Live Like the World is Ending by Margaret Killoy