Alexandra Hudson, writer and author of "The Soul of Civility," joins Jonah Goldberg to discuss the distinction between civility and politeness, the need for robust debate, the difference between patriotism and nationalism, and the importance of cultivating positive values for the joint project of civilization.
Civility goes beyond politeness, involving treating others as moral equals and engaging in robust debate.
Hospitality is a crucial expression of civility that fosters human flourishing and community.
The rise of liberalism and the importance of civility are interconnected, contributing to peace and prosperity in liberal democracies.
Deep dives
The Importance of Flourishing Across Deep Difference
The podcast episode discusses the central question of how we can flourish across deep difference in our current divided moment. The speaker emphasizes that this question is not new and has been a defining question of liberal democracy and the human social project. The episode explores the duality of human nature, the fragility of living well with others, and the need to sustain the joint project of civility. The goal is to achieve the stuff of the good life, even in the face of modern challenges such as social media and media culture.
The Distinction Between Civility and Politeness
The podcast delves into the difference between civility and politeness. While politeness refers to external behavior and manners, civility is described as an internal disposition of the heart. Civility involves seeing others as moral equals and treating them with respect based on their innate human dignity. The episode highlights that civility often requires actions that go beyond politeness, such as telling hard truths and engaging in robust debate. It is important to disambiguate these two concepts to have a clearer understanding of what we want more of and less of in public discourse.
The Power of Hospitality and the Practice of Civility
The podcast explores the concept of hospitality as a high expression of civility. It emphasizes that hospitality is an act of goodness that is crucial for human flourishing and community. The episode discusses the historical significance of hospitality in human culture and its role in acknowledging our common humanity. While modernity has made us less dependent on hospitality, the episode argues that we are still capable of practicing it. It highlights the risks and vulnerabilities involved in both being a guest and a host, emphasizing the importance of mutual respect and understanding.
The Rise of Liberalism and the Importance of Civility
One of the main ideas discussed in the podcast is the connection between the rise of liberalism and the importance of civility. The speaker highlights the story of Norbert Elias, a sociologist who argued that the rediscovery of classical Greco-Roman texts during the Renaissance led to a reemphasis on manners, etiquette, and social control. This renewed focus on individual self-control and conduct paved the way for peace, prosperity, and the emergence of liberal democracies. The podcast also delves into the works of Erasmus of Rotterdam, an unsung hero of moderation who advocated for civility and manners. The speaker emphasizes that civility and social norms contribute to a well-ordered society and are essential in times of high stakes and conflict.
The Challenges of Maintaining Civility in the Present Moment
The podcast explores the challenges related to maintaining civility in the present moment. The speaker acknowledges that contemporary society is marked by divisive rhetoric, a hatred for hypocrisy, and a culture that values authenticity over manners and politeness. However, the podcast emphasizes the importance of maintaining civility and decency, even in times of conflict and high stakes. It argues that dehumanizing others and resorting to malicious and vicious behavior are symptoms of an unhealthy soul and contribute to a decline in society. The podcast encourages individuals to cultivate a well-ordered disposition, to restrain their own passions, and to show compassion towards others, even when they are engaging in hurtful behaviors. It also highlights the power of individual actions and the potential for positive change by fostering connection and community in simple yet transformative ways.
Jonah’s even more sleep-deprived than usual on today’s Remnant due to dingo-related difficulties. Thankfully, however, his guest has more than enough rich insights on hand to keep him awake. He’s joined by Alexandra Hudson—writer, academic, and author of the new book, The Soul of Civility: Timeless Principles to Heal Society and Ourselves.
It’s clear that American society isn’t in a particularly civil state, and there’s plenty of appetite for improvement. But Alexandra thinks that we often fail to grasp what civility really means in the first place. Armed with an esoteric collection of historical references, she and Jonah explore what the distinction is between civility and politeness, how we can bring about a “civility renaissance,” and why civility is foundational to liberal democracy. Break out your bingo cards.
