AI-powered
podcast player
Listen to all your favourite podcasts with AI-powered features
The Seen and the Unseen - hosted by Amit Varma
Ep 359: Danish Husain and the Multiverse of Culture
Dec 11, 2023
Danish Husain, a writer, actor, poet, and storyteller, talks about his life and learnings. Topics include transformative power of art, fluidity of time, pausing and assessing during transitions, the power of resonant poetry, existential angst and search for home, acquired identities versus inherited identities, positive interactions in concrete spaces, lack of dialogue and toxic online groups, preserving cultures and languages, importance of disseminating knowledge and overcoming prejudices, politics in language and gender formulations, impact of language on reading, anxieties of identity and self-reflection, significance of form in music and performance, trade-off between artistic integrity and validation, importance of sound and rhythm in theater and poetry, Dastanghui performance art, storytelling and social media engagement, challenges faced by artists in the creator economy, pursuing a career in acting, dangers of 'follow your heart' advice, transitioning from theatre to cinema, power of sharing personal stories and shifting perspectives through art, and discussion on two poems.
06:17:49
Episode guests
AI Summary
Highlights
AI Chapters
Episode notes
Podcast summary created with Snipd AI
Quick takeaways
- Different professions contribute to different aspects of our identity, with artists turning to self-reflection in their creative process.
- Memory and understanding of time shape our narratives and reflections on the past.
- The search for one's place, home, and identity is a deep and philosophical question.
- Growing up in a linguistically diverse household enriches storytelling and fosters a broader appreciation for language, culture, and human experiences.
- Intersectionality allows for a nuanced understanding of power structures and cultural diversity, enriching storytelling and challenging biases.
- Acting and storytelling require shedding self-consciousness and embracing vulnerability to convey authenticity and connect with the audience.
Deep dives
The Impact of Work on Identity
Our work shapes who we become, and different professions contribute to different aspects of our identity. Professionals like investment bankers and engineers tend to be outward-facing and focused on their work, while artists often look inward for inspiration. Artists, poets, writers, and filmmakers turn to self-reflection in their creative process, deepening their understanding of themselves and the human condition.
The Nature of Memory and Time
Memory works in snapshots, capturing significant moments and experiences. Our perception of time also changes as we age, feeling both short and long in different ways. We often divide our lives into chapters or epochs, reflecting on the choices we made at pivotal moments. Our memory and understanding of time shape our narratives and reflections on the past.
The Search for Home and Identity
The search for one's place, home, and identity is a deep and philosophical question. It is a quest to find a sense of belonging and understanding of oneself. The dynamics of identity have evolved over time, with a shift from acquired identities to an emphasis on inherited identities. The complexities of society and the role of acquired and inherited identities continue to impact our sense of self and our connection to the world.
Growing up in a linguistically diverse household
I grew up in a unique household where multiple languages were spoken, including Persian, English, Urdu, and Bojpuri. This diverse linguistic environment provided me with a rich understanding of different languages and cultures. I was exposed to poetry, literature, and conversations in various languages, which shaped my perspective and storytelling abilities. This background has been instrumental in my career, enabling me to effortlessly navigate different languages and connect with diverse audiences.
The privilege of language and nuanced discourse
Growing up in a linguistically diverse household gave me the privilege of a broader understanding of communication and nuanced discourse. While English education was emphasized for professional success, I witnessed the importance of languages like Urdu, Farsi, and Hindi in our family's cultural conversations. This exposure set me apart from others and allowed me to appreciate the richness of different languages and their ability to convey complex ideas. I believe that this multilingual upbringing has played a significant role in my storytelling and writing endeavors, enabling me to bring a unique perspective to my work.
The advantage of intersectionality in language and identity
My upbringing in a household that celebrated diverse languages and identities provided me with a distinct advantage. Being at the intersection of privilege and minority background exposed me to multiple perspectives and made me aware of the societal dynamics at play. This awareness allowed me to develop a nuanced understanding of power structures and cultural diversity. It also shaped my ability to empathize, engage in difficult conversations, and challenge deeply rooted biases. This intersectionality has enriched my storytelling, giving voice to marginalized narratives and fostering a broader appreciation for language, culture, and human experiences.
Discovering Hindi Literature Again: A Homecoming
After being exposed to Hindi literature at a young age, the love for reading grew with time, leading to the exploration of world literature during college. This exposure expanded the thirst for knowledge and led to a deeper understanding of storytelling and performance. The journey to find oneself and shape identity was marked by the pursuit of acting, exploring the power of indigenous languages, and realizing the importance of knowing one's own language. With each step, the anxieties of fitting in and self-discovery were confronted, leading to a deeper understanding of the process of storytelling and acting.
Anxieties of Identity: Fitting In and Finding Oneself
The anxieties of fitting in and finding oneself are universal experiences, and they were an important part of the journey. The desire to fit in and fear of what others think can shape one's actions and choices. However, the process of self-discovery and shaping identity is often filled with uncertainties and challenges. The journey of self-reflection and exploration, from pursuing a career in economics to following the passion for acting, provided insight and growth. Through acting and storytelling, anxieties related to acceptance and affirmation were understood and navigated, ultimately leading to a deeper understanding of oneself.
Understanding the Process of Acting and Storytelling
The process of acting and storytelling played a significant role in understanding identity and overcoming anxieties. The journey involved shedding self-consciousness and embracing vulnerability, particularly when performing in front of an audience. The realization that true portrayal of emotions requires letting go of self-consciousness and embracing the character's emotions authentically allowed for a deeper connection with the audience. By focusing on the content, dialogue, and being present in the moment, the anxieties of perception and acceptance were overshadowed, resulting in a more powerful and authentic performance.
The Importance of Performance and Self-Consciousness
Performance becomes fake when self-consciousness creeps in. The audience can easily detect a lack of honesty or truthfulness on stage. It is crucial for actors to find the organicness of their performance and avoid self-doubt to convey authenticity to the audience. This process of exploring performance without self-consciousness leads to a deeper understanding of human psychology and personal anxieties.
The Anxiety of Being Relevant
One of the greatest fears individuals face is the anxiety of becoming irrelevant. In the artistic world, there is a constant pursuit for relevance and acknowledgment, driven by the fear of being forgotten. However, to grow as an artist, one must overcome this fear and focus on finding their unique voice rather than seeking external validation.
Form, Intuition, and Emotional Intelligence in Performance
The form or medium of performance significantly impacts how the story is told and the audience's engagement. Understanding the form, such as stage or screen, helps actors adjust their physicality, projection, and performance style. Additionally, emotional intelligence plays a crucial role in portraying authentic performances. Emotional intelligence helps actors assimilate knowledge and provide insights through non-verbal storytelling, a form of performance that speaks to the audience on a deeper level.
The Revival and Popularity of Dastangoi
Dastangoi, a form of storytelling, achieved widespread popularity despite initial skepticism. The allure of something new and different attracted audiences to this revival of an archaic art form. The innate human desire to experience thrill and engage with novelty helped pave the way for Dastangoi's success. It became democratized, with numerous practitioners, and went beyond the influence or recognition of any one individual. The movement continued to grow, attracting practitioners from diverse backgrounds and perspectives.
Navigating the Entertainment Industry
The evolving taste in the entertainment industry poses both challenges and opportunities. Taste has been influenced by exposure to global entertainment, with viewers seeking out films, shows, and art forms from various cultures. OTT platforms and technological advancements have played a significant role in the democratization and diversification of the industry. While there are gatekeepers to navigate, emerging platforms and opportunities have made it possible to reach audiences directly. Imagination, adaptation, and a macro vision of industry trends are key in finding success in this ever-changing landscape.
Taking a Stand on Principles
In the face of an individual's accusation of sexual assault, the importance of standing by principles becomes paramount. It requires courage to take a stand against a friend and part ways with them, especially when there may be personal and commercial interests tied to that partnership. However, choosing to prioritize principles and support victims is crucial for personal integrity and living with oneself. The decision may lead to facing consequences within a particular community, but the ability to sleep well and live authentically outweighs the cost.
Exploring Different Forms of Art
In this podcast episode, the guest discusses various forms of art that have had a profound impact on him. He recommends books like Milan Kundera's 'The Joke,' Saul Bellow's 'Herzog,' and Edward Said's works. He also suggests reading works by Mary Oliver, Don Delillo, and Salman Rushdie. In terms of cinema, he recommends films like 'Mughal-E-Azam,' 'Charulata,' and Satyajit Ray's films. He shares that these works have inspired and influenced him.
The Power of Poetry
The guest emphasizes the impact and significance of poetry in his life. He recites and translates various poems by renowned poets, such as an Urdu poem by Iqbal, a poem by W.S. Merwin, and his own poems. He highlights the ability of poetry to convey complex emotions and ideas in a concise and powerful manner.
He is a writer, an actor, a poet, a storyteller, an anti-storyteller -- and he cares about both the world outside and the one inside. Danish Husain joins Amit Varma in episode 359 of The Seen and the Unseen to talk about his life and learnings. (FOR FULL LINKED SHOW NOTES, GO TO SEENUNSEEN.IN.) Also check out: 1. Danish Husain on Twitter, Instagram, Facebook, Wikipedia and IMDb. 2. TheHoshrubaRepertory, Qissebaazi and Poetrification. 3. Danish Husain interviewed by Irfan for Jashn-e-Rekhta. 4. The art of storytelling -- Danish Husain interviewed by Purva Naresh. 5. 'Becoming the story when performing it' -- Danish Husain interviewed by Roanna Gonsalves. 6. The 27 Club. 7. Self-Portrait — AK Ramanujan. 8. The Mysterious Arrival of an Unusual Letter -- Mark Strand. 9. Collected Poems — Mark Strand. 10. Man's Search For Meaning -- Viktor E Frankl. 11. The Importance of Satya — Episode 241 of The Seen and the Unseen (w Uday Bhatia). 12. Amitava Kumar Finds the Breath of Life — Episode 265 of The Seen and the Unseen. 13. Aadha Gaon — Rahi Masoom Raza. 14. Out of Place: A Memoir -- Edward Said. 15. The Incredible Insights of Timur Kuran — Episode 349 of The Seen and the Unseen. 16. Private Truths, Public Lies — Timur Kuran. 17. Varun Grover Is in the House — Episode 292 of The Seen and the Unseen. 18. The Gita Press and Hindu Nationalism — Episode 139 of The Seen and the Unseen (w Akshaya Mukul). 19. Gita Press and the Making of Hindu India — Akshaya Mukul. 20. Where Have All The Leaders Gone? — Amit Varma. 21. Santosh Desai is Watching You -- Episode 356 of The Seen and the Unseen. 22. The Life and Times of Nilanjana Roy — Episode 284 of The Seen and the Unseen. 23. Bombay--London--New York -- Amitava Kumar. 24. Fighting Fake News — Episode 133 of The Seen and the Unseen (w Pratik Sinha). 25. Sample SSR conspiracy theory: He’s alive! 26. Life is Elsewhere -- Milan Kundera. 27. The Four Quadrants of Conformism — Paul Graham. 28. Ignaz Semmelweis on Britannica and Wikipedia. 29. India’s Tryst With Pandemics -- Episode 205 of The Seen and the Unseen (w Chinmay Tumbe). 30. Age of Pandemics — Chinmay Tumbe. 31. Kashi Ka Assi — Kashinath Singh. 32. A Meditation on Form — Amit Varma. 33. Scene: 75 -- Rahi Masoom Raza (translated by Poonam Saxena). 34. Folktales From India — Edited by AK Ramanujan. 35. The Indianness of Indian Food — Episode 95 of The Seen and the Unseen (w Vikram Doctor). 36. The Refreshing Audacity of Vinay Singhal — Episode 291 of The Seen and the Unseen. 37. Stage.in. 38. The Age of Average -- Alex Murrell. 39. Nothing is Indian! Everything is Indian! -- Episode 12 of Everything is Everything. 40. Wanderers, Kings, Merchants: The Story of India through Its Languages — Peggy Mohan. 41. Understanding India Through Its Languages — Episode 232 of The Seen and the Unseen (w Peggy Mohan). 42. Early Indians — Tony Joseph. 43. Early Indians — Episode 112 of The Seen and the Unseen (w Tony Joseph). 44. Caste, Capitalism and Chandra Bhan Prasad — Episode 296 of The Seen and the Unseen. 45. ‘Indian languages carry the legacy of caste’ — Chandra Bhan Prasad interviewed by Sheela Bhatt. 46. The Loneliness of the Indian Woman — Episode 259 of The Seen and the Unseen (w Shrayana Bhattacharya). 47. Premchand, Hardy Boys, Nancy Drew and Agatha Christie on Amazon. 48. Milan Kundera, Gabriel Garcia Marquez, Saul Bellow, Henry Miller and Octavio Paz on Amazon.. 49. Midnight's Children -- Salman Rushdie. 50. Selected Poems -- Dom Moraes. 51. Theatres of Independence -- Aparna Bhargava Dharwadker. 52. Saadat Hasan Manto and Ismat Chugtai on Amazon. 53. Toba Tek Singh -- Saadat Hasan Manto. 55. How Music Works -- David Byrne. 56. Danish Husain's anecdote about Mahatma Gandhi and Bade Ghulam Ali Khan. 57. Poems -- Louise Glück. 58. Harmony in the Boudoir -- Mark Strand. 59. And Then One Day: A Memoir -- Naseeruddin Shah. 60. Kohrra -- Created by Sudip Sharma and directed by Randeep Jha.. 61. If You Are a Creator, This Is Your Time -- Amit Varma. 62. Make Me a Canteen for My Soul — Episode 304 of The Seen and the Unseen (w Sameer Seth and Yash Bhanage). 63. The Aaron Levie tweet on the market for cars. 64. 'A feeble no may mean yes': Indian court overturns rape conviction -- Michael Safi. 65. Grace is Poetry -- Danish Husain. 66. Train-Track Figure -- Kay Ryan. 67. अंधा कबाड़ी -- नून मीम राशिद. 68. The Conjurer of Meaning -- Danish Husain. 69. Converse: Contemporary English Poetry by Indians -- Edited by Sudeep Sen. 67. Yearbook of Indian Poetry in English: 2022 -- Edited by Sukrita Paul Kumar & Vinita Agrawal. 68. मत बुरा उस को कहो गरचे वो अच्छा भी नहीं -- कलीम आजिज़. 69. शम्-ए-तन्हा की तरह सुब्ह के तारे जैसे -- इरफ़ान सिद्दीक़ी.. 70. हुस्न-ए-मह गरचे ब-हंगाम-ए-कमाल अच्छा है -- मिर्ज़ा ग़ालिब. 71. हिरास -- साहिर लुधियानवी. 72. Separation -- WS Merwin 73. वो जो इक शर्त थी वहशत की उठा दी गई क्या -- इरफ़ान सिद्दीक़ी. 74. तुम्हें डर है. -- गोरख पाण्डेय. 75. शायद कि ये ज़माना उन्हें पूजने लगे -- अब्दुल वहाब सुख़न. 76. Kya sitam hai waqt ka -- Madan Mohan Danish. 77. फ़राज़ अब कोई सौदा कोई जुनूँ भी नहीं -- फ़राज़. 78. कौन-सी बात कहाँ , कैसे कही जाती है -- वसीम बरेलवी. 79. A Plain Landscape -- Danish Husain. 80. इतिहास की कगार -- दानिश हुसैन. 81. Jawaab -- Kumar Ambuj (translated by Danish Husain). 82. Your Touch -- Danish Husain. 83. The Joke -- Milan Kundera. 84. Herzog -- Saul Bellow. 85. Edward Said, Mary Oliver and Toni Morrison on Amazon. 86. Step Across This Line -- Salman Rushdie. 87. Harishankar Parsai, John Kenneth Galbraith and AS Byatt on Amazon. 88. Garam Hawa -- MS Sathyu. 89. Shatranj Ke Khilari -- Satyajit Ray. 90. The Godfather -- Francis Ford Coppolla. 91. Do Ankhen Barah Haath -- V Shantaram. 92. Mandi -- Shyam Benegal. 93. Party -- Govind Nihalani. 94. Khosla Ka Ghosla! -- Dibakar Banerjee. This episode is sponsored by the Pune Public Policy Festival 2024, which takes place on January 19 & 20, 2024. The theme this year is Trade-offs! Amit Varma and Ajay Shah have launched a new video podcast. Check out Everything is Everything on YouTube. Check out Amit’s online course, The Art of Clear Writing. And subscribe to The India Uncut Newsletter. It’s free! Episode art: ‘The Actor as a Builder of Worlds’ by Simahina.
Get the Snipd
podcast app
Unlock the knowledge in podcasts with the podcast player of the future.
AI-powered
Discover
highlights
Listen to the best highlights from the podcasts you love and dive into the full episode
Save any
moment
Hear something you like? Tap your headphones to save it with AI-generated key takeaways
Share
& Export
Send highlights to Twitter, WhatsApp or export them to Notion, Readwise & more
AI-powered
podcast player
Listen to all your favourite podcasts with AI-powered features
Discover
highlights
Listen to the best highlights from the podcasts you love and dive into the full episode