Where Have All the Lesbians Gone? - Katie Herzog | Maiden Mother Matriarch 53
Feb 18, 2024
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Discussion on why many women have stopped identifying as lesbians and started identifying as non-binary and bisexual, passing privilege and social attitudes towards tomboys, impact of AIDS on gay activism, 'gays against groomers' phenomenon, and drag queen story hour in the UK
Many lesbians shifting to non-binary or bisexual labels due to passing privilege and societal incentives.
Society responds more negatively to gender nonconforming men, highlighting the complexities of transitioning.
Female sexuality is fluid, with women exhibiting more bisexual tendencies and influenced by representation and exposure.
Deep dives
The disappearance of lesbians and the rise of non-binary identity
The podcast episode explores the phenomenon of fewer women identifying as lesbians while more identify as non-binary. The speaker discusses anecdotal evidence of lesbian women transitioning to men or adopting the non-binary label. This trend is found to be contradictory to survey data that shows higher rates of women identifying as bisexual, but lower rates of same-sex contact. The speaker points out that some women who identify as bisexual or queer still primarily engage in heterosexual relationships. The motivations behind these shifts in identity are discussed, including social incentives and the appeal of passing privilege. The speaker also highlights the lack of introspection and acknowledgement within the queer community regarding the overall trend.
The impact of transitioning on individuals
The podcast delves into the impact of transitioning on individuals, focusing on the experiences of gender nonconforming men. The speaker highlights that society tends to respond more negatively to gender nonconforming men compared to gender nonconforming women. Passing privilege, beauty privilege, and potential fetishization are explored as factors influencing societal perceptions. The speaker shares personal anecdotes of friends experiencing transitioning and the challenges they faced in terms of societal acceptance. The complexities of transitioning, including health issues and potential regrets, are also discussed.
Fluidity of female sexuality
The podcast explores the topic of female sexuality and its relative fluidity. The speaker challenges the idea that sexual orientation applies to women in the same way as it does to men, suggesting that women tend to exhibit more bisexual tendencies. They cite studies indicating that women generally respond to various sexual stimuli, regardless of gender, which may be linked to evolved protective mechanisms. The speaker also emphasizes the importance of representation and exposure to influence one's understanding and exploration of their own sexuality.
Double standards and societal attitudes
The podcast addresses double standards in society's attitudes towards different gender expressions. It highlights that society tends to be more accepting of gender nonconforming women (tomboys) compared to gender nonconforming men (such as AGP individuals). The speaker speculates on the instinctual reactions behind these attitudes, suggesting that fear and discomfort are associated with male gender nonconformity due to the perceived clustering of certain paraphilias. The speaker also discusses the impact of cultural and societal norms on these attitudes and the expectations placed on individuals based on their gender expression.
Potential future changes and perspectives
The podcast considers the potential future trends in attitudes and perceptions towards gender and sexuality. While acknowledging that societal views may shift, the speaker emphasizes that transgender identities have been present throughout history and are unlikely to disappear entirely. They encourage an open conversation and exploration of the complexities of gender dysphoria and related issues, while also recognizing the challenges and risks associated with transitions. The speaker also advocates for more nuanced discussions regarding identity, society, and the impacts of representation.
My guest today is Katie Herzog, journalist and host of the Blocked and Reported podcast. We spoke about why so many women have stopped identifying as lesbians and started identifying as non-binary and bisexual, about 'passing privilege' and social attitudes towards tomboys, and I also expounded on my theory of 'nonce radar.' In the extended part of the episode, we spoke about the impact that AIDS had on gay activism, the 'gays against groomers' phenomenon, and why drag queen story hour is now such a big deal in the UK.
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