Recent graduates, Heather Sherlock and Diego Espinosa of the 'Planners under the Influence' podcast cross interview Jess Noonan and Peter Jewell of the PlanningxChange podcast. Youth and hope meet 'manufacture hardened' professionals. A lively discussion with many different perspectives on what makes for good cities, the state of university training, the role of developers, influencers and shared podcasting experiences. Sweet bird of youth meets somewhat wiser owls. For more details: www.planningxchange.org. There was a problem with the audio on the original release, error corrected 8 January 2020. Apologies for the gaps in the audio.