Capitalism Has Mutated Into Something Worse with Yanis Varoufakis
Feb 7, 2024
01:08:13
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Yanis Varoufakis, former finance minister of Greece, joins Adam Conover to discuss how capitalism has transformed into something worse with the rise of tech giants. They explore topics such as the domination of big tech, surveillance capitalism, the perverted culture of sharing on the internet, and the centralization of the internet. They also touch on the rise of wealthy individuals in the digital age and the need to protect personal data. The conversation delves into the transformation of the economy and the potential implications for global power dynamics.
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Quick takeaways
Massive tech corporations dominate the economy, extracting profits from users without producing anything themselves.
The close relationship between big tech companies and central banks has fueled the rise of techno-feudalism.
The concentration of power in the hands of techno-feudal lords raises challenges for society and questions about the future of capitalism.
Deep dives
The Rise of Cloud Capital and Techno-Feudalism
The economic system has evolved into something far worse than traditional capitalism, according to Janus Varoufakis, the former finance minister of Greece. He argues that massive tech companies, such as Amazon and Facebook, have become monopolistic polymorphous mega-entities that control and manipulate our behavior through sophisticated algorithms. These companies extract rent from consumers and producers without actually producing anything themselves. Varoufakis refers to this new economic system as techno-feudalism, where cloud capital replaces traditional capital as the main source of wealth creation. The centralization of power and the ability to modify our behavior through algorithms creates a sense of servitude to these tech giants, reminiscent of feudalism.
The Role of Central Banks and State Financing
Another key factor in the rise of techno-feudalism is the close relationship between big tech companies and central banks. Varoufakis notes that the central banks have printed trillions of dollars and pumped them into the private banking system to reflow finance. However, instead of stimulating investment and boosting the economy, much of this money has been invested in cloud capital, funded by the state. For example, Varoufakis estimates that 90% of the funds used to build Meta (formerly Facebook) came from central bank money. The combination of state funding and the technologies developed by society has given rise to a new breed of feudal lords, the cloud analysts, who control and extract rent from the digital fiefdoms they have created.
Implications for Society and the Global Power Struggle
The spread of cloud capital and techno-feudalism has profound implications for society and the global power dynamics. Varoufakis highlights the financialization process, where cloud thieves like Amazon and WeChat in China transform smaller businesses into mini banks, providing microloans to local communities. Moreover, the clash between American and Chinese cloud thieves reflects a wider power struggle between Wall Street and Silicon Valley. Policymakers in Washington fear that their reliance on Wall Street for the dollar payment system puts them at a disadvantage compared to Chinese tech giants, who have their own digital payment systems. Whether this clash intensifies or a truce is reached, the concentration of power in the hands of techno-feudal lords poses challenges for society and raises questions about the future of capitalism itself.
The privatization of the Internet
The podcast discusses the evolution of the Internet from a decentralized and commons-based space to a highly centralized and privatized environment. In the early days, the Internet was seen as a place where anyone could create a website and sell products directly. However, over time, a few giant firms have come to dominate the online landscape, such as Amazon, Google, and Facebook. This transformation happened rapidly, and now, if individuals want to sell something online, they have to go through these few companies. The podcast highlights how this shift has led to a loss of the Internet's original decentralized and commons-based nature.
The need for socializing digital ownership
The podcast explores the idea of socializing the ownership of digital algorithms and platforms. It makes the case for the public to have a stake in the profits generated by companies like Facebook and Google, considering that users provide free labor by creating content and generating data. The podcast suggests that instead of relying solely on regulation or taxation, people should push for a transition to a system where shares of these tech companies are deposited into a social equity fund, which would accumulate dividends. These dividends could then be distributed to the public, potentially in the form of a basic income. The podcast emphasizes the importance of understanding the difference between traditional capitalism and cloud capital, and the need for collective ownership of algorithms and digital platforms.
Capitalism has changed. A century ago, capitalists amassed untold wealth by building and manufacturing goods, but today, our economy appears to be dominated by massive tech corporations that don't actually produce anything at all. Instead, these tech giants offer platforms—such as search engines, AI, or marketplaces—through which they extract profits from users. Adam speaks with Yanis Varoufakis, former finance minister of Greece, about his book Technofeudalism: What Killed Capitalism, exploring how this new form of capitalism jeopardizes our livelihoods and what measures we can take to safeguard our future from big tech. Find Yanis's book at at factuallypod.com/books
About Headgum: Headgum is an LA & NY-based podcast network creating premium podcasts with the funniest, most engaging voices in comedy to achieve one goal: Making our audience and ourselves laugh. Listen to our shows at https://www.headgum.com.