In this conversation, Mike, a thoughtful theologian, and David, a contributor on biblical narratives, dive into intriguing topics. They tackle questions like the significance of baptism and the complexities surrounding the baptism of the Holy Spirit. Mike shares insights on discrepancies in biblical accounts, including census numbers and the story of King Saul. They explore sensitive topics like the interpretation of women's roles in churches and the perspective on homosexuality. With humor and depth, they encourage an open dialogue about faith, scripture, and understanding.
The hosts emphasize the importance of fostering a safe community for discussing biblical topics among diverse viewpoints.
They express a cautious yet appreciative stance towards Dr. Michael Heiser's interpretations of spiritual beings in the Bible.
The podcast discusses the theological debate around 'once saved, always saved,' highlighting the complexity of scriptural assurances on salvation.
They encourage unity among Christians despite doctrinal differences, promoting love and grace as foundational in these discussions.
The significance of baptism is affirmed as an act of obedience, yet it is clarified that it’s not a prerequisite for salvation.
The discussion on animals in the afterlife reflects hope for creation's redemption while acknowledging the lack of explicit biblical teachings.
Deep dives
Introduction of Hosts and Purpose
The episode begins with the hosts, Matt and Dave, introducing themselves and sharing the origins of their involvement in moderating a subreddit focused on discussions about the Bible. Matt explains that his journey into moderation started with a mobile game before moving on to the Bible subreddit over the last three years. He emphasizes the importance of creating a safe community where people can engage openly about their thoughts and questions on biblical topics without the fear of judgment. This foundational idea sets the stage for the ensuing Q&A format where listeners' questions will be addressed thoroughly.
Discussion on Michael Heiser's Works
Matt and Dave broach the topic of Michael Heiser's work, particularly regarding his discussions on spiritual beings and concepts such as the Divine Council. They collectively appreciate Heiser's ability to simplify complex scholarly ideas into accessible content for the layperson. While they share some agreement with his views on certain supernatural elements in the Bible, they also express a level of caution regarding his interpretations, particularly when it diverges from traditional understandings. Their nuanced appreciation indicates that while Heiser's work opens up interesting discussions, it is equally important to apply critical analysis to his conclusions.
The Debate Around Once Saved, Always Saved
The discussion shifts to the theological concept of 'once saved, always saved,' particularly in the context of the book of Hebrews. The hosts reflect on the ambiguities within scripture that complicate the assurance of salvation, especially in light of certain warnings about falling away. Matt expresses his inclination that apostasy might be possible, suggesting that losing faith equates to rejecting salvation. This nuanced perspective highlights the challenge of reconciling scriptural warnings with assurance in faith, underscoring the need for careful study and understanding.
Navigating Denominational Differences
A listener's query about how Christians can maintain unity amidst denominational differences prompts a thoughtful discussion among the hosts. They argue that while there are essential doctrines one should not compromise, many secondary issues should not lead to division. Matt and Dave give examples of how personal relationships can endure despite differing theological views, suggesting that love and grace should govern interactions. The speakers emphasize the importance of mutual respect and understanding, encouraging open dialogue and acceptance of diverse interpretations within the Christian community.
The Importance of Baptism
The topic of baptism emerges as relevant in light of a listener's concerns about doctrinal disagreements in their area. The hosts affirm the significance of baptism as a vital act of obedience and a public declaration of faith, but they clarify that it is not a requirement for salvation. They encourage individuals to seek a church that emphasizes genuine faith, rather than requiring stringent adherence to every single doctrine. Overall, they articulate a balanced view on baptism, recognizing its value while allowing for variations in understanding among different denominations.
Understanding the Baptism of the Spirit
A listener asks about the concept of baptism in the Holy Spirit, prompting the hosts to explore differing beliefs in Christian circles. They discuss how some traditions see baptism in the Spirit as a separate event from salvation, while others consider it synonymous with receiving the Holy Spirit upon conversion. They emphasize that the biblical texts point to all believers experiencing the indwelling of the Holy Spirit at the moment of their salvation, thus aligning with the idea that healing, empowerment, and gifts may occur thereafter. This comprehensive analysis invites listeners to consider the vital role of the Holy Spirit in the life of believers.
Evaluating Different Bible Translations
The conversation transitions to the use of various Bible translations, as a listener inquires which version is best for newcomers to the faith. The hosts generally recommend starting with the New Living Translation for its accessibility and ease of understanding, especially for first-time readers. They note that while translations like the ESV or NASB are excellent for in-depth study, the focus for new readers should be digestible scripture. This perspective underscores the importance of engaging with the Bible while recognizing differing needs depending on one's familiarity and theological background.
Confronting Skepticism Toward Scriptures
A listener highlights skepticism regarding contradictions within biblical texts, particularly surrounding difficult passages like those in 1 Chronicles and 2 Samuel. The hosts delve into the nature of scripture, affirming the importance of contextual understanding and the historical background of each text. They reassess various contradictions as opportunities for deeper study rather than obstacles that undermine faith. This approach encourages listeners to confront difficult questions with the knowledge that many apparent inconsistencies can be resolved through examination and prayerful contemplation.
Examining the Fate of Unbelievers
In response to a question about the fate of those who have never heard the Gospel, the hosts engage with the complexities of God's justice and mercy. They express that scripture indicates God judges based on the knowledge one has received, suggesting an opportunity for salvation outside of explicit Gospel knowledge. The conversation broadens to include God’s nature as loving and just, as well as the responsibility of Christians to share the message. This leads to a deep reflection on the role of believers in evangelism and outreach, emphasizing that ignorance of the Gospel is not a justification for a lack of accountability.
On Animals and Eternity
A listener grapples with the topic of animals and their fate in the afterlife, prompting the hosts to explore Ecclesiastes and Romans 8 regarding creation's redemption. They explain that while scripture doesn't provide explicit teaching on the afterlife of animals, it does affirm that God's creation is good and worthy of restoration. The hosts encourage hopefulness surrounding the presence of animals in the new heaven and new earth, despite the lack of direct scriptural support. They conclude with the understanding that while pastoral hope is valuable, clear doctrinal teachings about animals should remain cautious.
Causality in Human Effort and Divine Sovereignty
The topic turns to the intricacies of causality within the context of divine sovereignty and human effort, especially concerning victory and success. The hosts elaborate on how scripture acknowledges both God's providential hand and human responsibility in achieving outcomes. They provide examples from scripture showing how God blesses efforts while also emphasizing the necessity of wise planning and preparation. This duality serves to highlight that faith involves action, and believers should expect the divine to support their efforts when aligned with His will.
Interpretation of Jesus' Metaphorical Language
A listener asks about the nuanced interpretation of Jesus’ metaphorical language during the Last Supper, particularly regarding communion. The hosts dissect the context of Jesus' statements, arguing for a symbolic understanding rather than a literal interpretation of the elements of bread and wine. They emphasize that the Jewish context during the Last Supper, deeply rooted in symbolism, informs Jesus' intent of creating a new covenant. They clarify that while Jesus uses vivid imagery, the intended meaning aligns with a symbolic, rather than literal, transformation of the elements.
Thoughts on Bart Ehrman’s Work
Finally, the hosts discuss Bart Ehrman and his scholarly contributions, specifically his perspectives on biblical textual criticism. They highlight the dangers of interpreting his work without understanding the broader scholarly context. The consensus among the hosts is that while Ehrman presents interesting challenges and discussions surrounding textual integrity, his conclusions about the nature of scripture can often be misleading. They encourage listeners to approach Ehrman’s work with a critical yet open mind while remaining grounded in solid theological foundations.
0:00 Intro 1- 0:24 Who are these guys from Reddit? 2- 3:36 Mike's thoughts on Dr. Michael Heiser 3- 9:41 Can you lose your salvation? 4- 16:23 Handling doctrinal disagreement on secondary stuff 5- 24:09 How important is baptism? 6- 27:17 Define “Baptism in the Spirit” 7- 36:23 Which Bible version and where to read when you are… 8- 43:59 Mike’s response to King James Onlyists 9- 47:27 David’s census and why the numbers don’t match 10- 1:06:49 Did God tempt David? 11- 1:10:36 Is the Bible’s history out of order? 12- 1:12:33 Does Mike find contradictions in the Bible? 13- 1:14:36 Why doesn’t Mike play that guitar more? 14- 1:16:14 Why must women be silent? (This is only an answer to one passage, not every related passage) 15- 1:28:56 Why does Leviticus say homosexual behavior is an abomination? 16- 1:43:18 What about meditation and mantras? 17- 1:46:33 If I have the Holy Spirit why do I need the Bible? 18- 1:49:19 Is “Omnism” ok? 19- 1:55:30 About people who NEVER hear the Gospel 20- 2:02:40 What’s the right view of biblical causality? 21- 2:11:24 Catholicism and the Lord’s supper 22- 2:17:10 Jesus as the “firstborn of all creation” 23- 2:22:06 The Witch of Endor (not a Star Wars reference) 24- 2:27:44 Are animals resurrected? 25- 2:35:38 Mike’s thoughts on Bart Ehrman 26- 2:40:19 It’s over, we just blabbin
This interview was filmed several months ago when I was asked by the moderators of the subreddit r/bible, to respond to a bunch of questions from their subreddit. So I fielded a number of extremely challenging questions (and a couple easy ones) in an interview that took over three hours to film, once you factor in how much time was spent sound and video testing before we could begin. Anyhow, we may seem a bit tired by the end but I hope you find the content helpful, thoughtful, and useful in learning to think biblically about everything.
