Today, Chuck is joined by Ben Hunt, the creator of Epsilon Theory. Their conversation revolves around the concept of the Widening Gyre, a “profound social equilibrium where bad people and bad ideas drive out good people and good ideas.” They discuss this concept from a few different angles:

• How it relates to top-down systems like America’s political systems and corporations.

• How it has led to the loss of a national narrative and increased division and conflict.

• How a community-based approach that focuses on doing the right thing today is the best way out.

• Hear more from Ben Hunt:

  • “Ben Hunt: We're Not Going to Fix This from the Top Down” (podcast).

  • “Ben Hunt: In Praise of Bitcoin” (podcast).

• Ben Hunt (Twitter/X).

• Epsilon Theory (site).

• Chuck Marohn (Substack).