Episode #63 – John Logar on Creating Massive Wealth as a Consultant

John McIntyre: Hey you listener it’s John McIntyre the autoresponder guy and it’s time for episode 63, the big 63 of the McMethod Email Marking Podcast where you’ll discover tactics and strategies to increase your email profits by 25% to 100% in 90 days or less. We have spending more and advertise.

The basic idea here is that what you’re going to learn is ultimately how to make more money in your business, how to make more sales, how to get more leads, how to convert more of those leads in the customers all with a simple 200 word, 300 word email.

It’s not very difficult. I’ve had recent listeners email me telling them one of them had $85,000 in the bank in five months after using basically everything he’d applied he’d learned from the McMethod Email Marketing Podcast, so listen in, grab a pen, you’re going to want it.

Today, we’re talking to John Logar. John is a very interesting guy. I actually got started with consulting way back in the day when I was just getting into it. I actually went through a product that John had done with another consultant Kyle Tully 00:00:57].

I’ve done an interview with Kyle Tully before but I’ve never done one with John. John is very cool because he gets some just incredible results. This isn’t consulting for a grand here, a grand there, two grand here, five grand there, this is consulting say anywhere from … It depends on the numbers but it will be around $3,000 to $10,000 a month for say 12 months, right and you may pick up 8 to 12 clients of that.

You’re going to be doing … This is the sort of level that John is playing at and then he’s coaching others. He’s really a consultant for consultants and that means he’s helping people like me and people in that sort of situation when they want to do this business to bring on that many clients.

Let’s say if you follow that strategy. If you had 10 clients of five grand a month, you’re making 50 grand a month. We’re talking some big numbers to get excited. It’s an honor to finally have him on the show I’ll just say that. To get the show links for this episode of the McMethod Email Marketing Podcast, go to the mcmethod.com/63.

Before we’re going to this interview with Mr. John Logar, I just had one thing it is the McMasters Insight of the week. If you don’t know, McMasters is the private membership forum that I have in an exclusive little community that I’ve got for people who want to learn how to do email marketing the right way with products like the McIntyre Method, Stories that Sell, a few things like that.

Anyway, there’s a forum in there. One thing we get out to is we have discussions on how to write a copy and how to write emails and how to make more sales and a lot of stuff. The insight for this week is this, say things with less words. I was coaching someone yesterday and one of the main issues with their copy was not that it had a good flow to it, it had some good ideas, it was catchy, it was entertaining, I enjoyed reading it.

The problem and I see this a lot, the problem of the copy was that it was too wordy. It used more words when it could just use less. This is the equivalent of saying … here’s a bad example but this will kind of illustrate the point. Right next to me on this table, there was a bottle of hydrogen, one atom of hydrogen, two atoms of oxygen otherwise known as water.

I could say that to be kind of clever to be a bit cutie, but really my good copy is to basically say, “On this table there’s a bottle of water.” It’s a bit of a bad of example but the idea in here is that if you can say something with less words, then say it with less words. 

You want to eliminate all the redundancies. This doesn’t just apply to writing a novel or writing a newspaper article. This applies to writing headlines, to writing all your copy. There’s that rule where, how long should the sales will be? As long as it needs to be. As long as you can keep at entertaining it should go as on, and on, and on but to be entertaining you have to eliminate all the things that don’t really matter to the core point, to the core purpose, to the message that you are really trying to communicate.

The lesson for today or the insight of the week is that I want you to go look at your emails and look at your sales letter, and look at the copy that you are putting out there and see if you can eliminate a line here, or a line there. As you write more copy get rid of the redundancies. Make it more clear, more to the point, quicker, faster, more flowy. 

If you want to learn more about McMasters or if you want to sign up for the community and get some coaching with me or connect with the other members, or go through the training products in there go to the mcmethod.com/macmasters. That’s all I have for the moment. I’m going to get back to my lunch over here. Some rice tomato, cheese, actually [inaudible 00:04:16] cheese, pretty delicious stuff and I’m going to live you to it to go and enjoy this interview with John Logar.

It’s John McIntyre here, the autoresponder guy. I’m here with John Logar. John is a business coach or a consultant. He helps other consultants not just make a little bit of money consulting but make a lot of money consulting doing really high end deals and  I actually first heard of John a couple of years ago when I was … before I was even the autoresponder guy. I’d done a bit of copy writing, I was just getting into the world of consulting and try to make some money so I could get by more than great by and great a lifestyle over here in Thailand, and one of the programs I went through was one that John had done with another consultant copy writing guy Carl Talley and that was a long time ago but I got a few ideas from that which ultimately led to the autoresponder guy, and the McMethod, and McMasters and all that stuff. 

John really knows his stuff and he’s been doing some very interesting stuff recently. One thing you did mention that really blew me away was that he’s done I think 900 one-on-one sessions or coaching clients, what kind of thing? Now only does he know how to make a lot of money. He knows how to teach other people how to do it well with consulting. We are going to get into some of the results he’s done recently and what the sort of the strategies behind what he did recently, how it made it work. We’ll get into that in a minute. First, John, how are you doing today man?

John:Hey John, it’s great to be here.

John McIntyre a:Good to have you on the show man.

John:It’s taken a while.

John McIntyre a:It has.

John:You are taking your time getting to me John.

John McIntyre a:I had a long list of people that … you are trying to keep track of who’s been on and who’s not. It’s getting that way.

John:Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 

John McIntyre a:All right, before we talk about these two different strategies today, give the listener a bit of a background on who is John Logar. I’ve done a little bit of it but you can probably give a better version. Who is John and what does he do?

John:I’m a consultant for consultants in one of my businesses. I do run my own digital marketing agency that works with specific clients in strategy especially online marketing strategies. With my consulting or mentoring programs, I run a program called Make Everyday a Pay Day and essentially that’s helping people who have some skills, who are looking to build a six-figure plus consulting business and looking to target, engage, and convert higher paying clients.

Whether that be corporate clients or looking to get clients putting in a retainer situation where they are picking up anywhere between $3,000 to $10,000 a month in retainer. Then I also just like you have a podcast called Business Unleashed as well.

John McIntyre a:Good old podcasting. Just to clarify there. You said was it $3,000 to $10,000 a month retainer and people are going to stick around for 12 months, and not only that the average [inaudible 00:06:49] you were saying does eight to 12 clients a month, which takes you from $40,000 to $60,000 per month in revenue and in [inaudible 00:06:54] it’s $300,000 a year, you are a one man shop, really great numbers especially for someone who’s just getting into consulting.

John:Absolutely and I think the biggest part of it is a lot of … it’s really funny. There’s a lot of people who have a lot of skills who’s been playing around in that marketing and direct response for many, many years, buying products, learning Facebook advertising and PPC and SEO. They’ve learned some cool stuff in their own journey of trying to make something happen or build businesses online. They’ve picked up a lot of skills. Those skills are translatable to very, very opportune … revenue opportunities within the offline world.

There’s a lot of guys out there who do offer local marketing or local consulting services but they tend to commoditize at the lower end. At the bigger end where businesses are larger but have larger sales volumes they don’t do anything when it comes to building sales funnels, direct response marketing. They tend to stick to traditional forms of marketing above the line, billboards, TV, radio advertising, trade shows.

They are missing out. The world is turning and changing. I think the playing field is rapidly changing in the market. There’s a whole bunch of people out there with great skills but they can translate into the offline world and these guys have no idea about the tech, the philosophy, the ideas, the strategies and really you can certainly charge great value for those types of services. The number job that’s been searched for at the moment out there is for digital marketing experts and whatever that means I don’t know.

Now there are digital marketing courses springing up and certifications and graduate degrees that are springing up that a lot of universities because from an [inaudible 00:08:32] marketing pool, from a marketing point of view, online is a very important component. It is getting much stronger. We are living and breathing off these great, little smart phones all over the world. In fact, in south east Asia the highest Internet connection rate is done through a smart phone not through a landline portal.

That’s where the opportunity is and I think people have got great skills but how do I package it up? How do I actually approach people to share those skills and help them engage and generate more revenue as well?

John McIntyre a:It sounds part of it too there’s a big mindset here where people get into it. “I know a little bit. I know you say I could do this John.” You tell me that I can get out and make all these ton of money but I just don’t know. A big part of this is there’s so much self-doubt. They know they’ve got skills. They know they could probably do it but are they going to go out there and do it? Probably not. They need to have that realization, it’s like yeah, if I go out there and do X, Y, Z. Step 1, 2 and 3 I’m going to be able to close a $5,000, a $10,000 a month client and do that every single month and do that for 12 months of the year.

John:Yeah and what you are doing … if you look at the translation of that it’s like you are building a membership client. Instead of getting $39.00 a month for a membership forum you’ve got a client paying you $3,000 to $6,000 to help them receive a result on a month to month basis. It’s like having a high-end membership program with one client.

John McIntyre a:What about the hours or the work that goes into this? Let’s say you are taking a $5,000 a month client to do some of their marketing, are you … is this going to be a pain in the ass? You are talking to these client every single day and working all day?

John:Based on the experience that I’ve had in my own business and certainly with the consults that I’m working with they probably spend about three to five hours a month with a client. It’s not a lot of time and at the same time they are leveraging their time through outsourcing through supplies to deliver the process. The goal is that they are working only a business in their business. They are not the technician. They are actually the project manager, the person who’s out there marketing and generating clients for their own business and then as a client comes in, they facilitate that project for that client by bringing in outsourced providers from all over the world if not in their local location and add their margins on top.

John McIntyre a:Do they have to be on location with these clients or can you do this from Skype? Could I do this from Thailand for example?

John:You could do this from anywhere in the world. All you need is a connection to the Internet of some form and Skype is an easy way to do this. In fact, if I look at all the consultants that I’ve been working with over the last year I would have to say that more than 70 percent of their clients are not in the city that they are located in.

John McIntyre a:Interesting.

John:They are doing it via email, Skype, LinkedIn, social networking. They’ll do it through forums. There’s a whole bunch of processes you can go and pick up corporate or business clients.

John McIntyre a:Okay because I was thinking for something like this for more high end stuff you’ve have to go in, you’ve have to give business cards out, meet someone in their office sit down and wine and dine them and all that crap.

John:No, it’s not uncommon. In fact, if I was looking at a guy who was one of my guys who is based out of Phoenix, Arizona half his … in fact he doesn’t have a single client in Phoenix and the average for him sits around the $8,000 to $10,000 month mark. It’s really funny. [Inaudible 00:11:36] and you there pick me up clients outside of your state. The Internet gives you that flexibility.

John McIntyre a:If you could to and then you are not worried about [inaudible 00:11:47] your client at the supermarket or at the bar at 3am or whatever it happens to be.

John:Why isn’t my campaign working? Why is my PPC on?

John McIntyre a:We are down with mark that out. That’s the benefits. That’s the goal that a lot of people are going for. This consulting lifestyle which is that you can make a ton of money and you don’t have to work. It’s not to make double what you make now. It’s not working twice as hard. It’s just working on the right things. Let’s talk about that, the right things. You mentioned two things, the two recent case studies and some of the lessons you learned from that. Let’s get into that. Let’s start with number one.

John:Number one is that people want cash and they cash fast. I’ve been sitting there thinking, how do you get cash in your business as quickly as possible? look at common sense and the guide here because a lot of people do not have common sense. There’s cause and effect. If you have a lot of office out there’s you’ve got a good chance that you are going to generate some revenue. The number one thing that a lot of people don’t do is they don’t offer things enough. I’ve heard you say things like on this podcast that I went from doing one email a month to a database to an email a day and as soon as you put that email a with an offer every single day your sales went through the roof.

John McIntyre a:That changed everything. It absolutely changed everything.

John:Yeah, the number one thing is that a lot of people don’t make offers but the other important thing is cash flow is key in your business. If you don’t have cash flow you are not in business essentially. The key to generating lots of cash flow is to get focused on what you need to do to generate it and just to give you a really simple perspective. It’s amazing how many businesses charge or send out invoices to clients and leave those invoices out there.

I was talking to an IT firm. They over 180 grand worth of invoices sitting out there to be paid as debits and I sat there and look, “Have you delivered the service for this product?” They said, “Yeah, we’ve delivered.” I said, “Why don’t you just get on the phone or get one of your team members on the phone and just ask those people to take care of that invoice today?” By the end of the week they’ve cloaked $100,000 worth of revenue business. Now they don’t give time payment. They ask for the payment up front and the payment is done on invoice and this way their cash flow has just gone through the roof now. 

Another simple strategy and this is probably one of my favorites was a printing firm that I sat down with. We were doing some consulting on strategy and they were sitting down saying, “Hey, we just need to get more quotes. We get more quotes we make more sale,” and I said, “Awesome. How many quotes do you get right now on an average per day?” He says, “We probably do 15 quotes a day.” I said, “Of those 15 quotes, how many do you close?” He said, “We probably do three to four of those quotes that we quote.”

In that we I’m sitting there saying, “What happens to the other 11 quotes? Where do they go?” He says, “[Inaudible 00:14:15] or we put them in the filing cabinet. They are all over here,” and I said, “Do you want to make some money and do you want to make it today? If you want to make a chunk of change, are you serious? Do you want to make it today?” “Yeah, we want to make some money today.” I said, “Let’s get you through sales guys. Let’s get you and get your partner and get some of your support team here who talk to the customers and we are going to pull out all the quotes for the last six months. Get all the filing files, get them on the table and put them in the center of the table.”

We are all sitting in the room and I said, “This is what’s going to happen. You’re going to ring, everyone of you are going to take a stack of these and you are going to call these clients and you’re going to ask them a simple series of questions. You did a quote a few months back from us on this particular project, did you go ahead with quote? Did you go ahead with that project? If you didn’t go ahead with the project, would you like to go ahead now? If that’s not an option for you, is there something else we can quote about? If you did go ahead with the project, who did you go with and why would you go with them?”

That was the series of questions that they were asking. By the end of the day $70,000 worth of revenue from quotes they’d written three to six months ago. Here’s the thing. They continued on in the month. That month they wrote $280,000 worth of business from quotes that they’d written in that sin month period. People wanted re-quotes, yes they went ahead with their projects. This was off old stuff. This is cash that they’ve picked up pretty much picked up straightaway business. Rapid cash flow is when you focus on generating income, naturally what’s going to happen? You are going to get some income from your business.

The thing is to develop focus on primary income generating strategies in your business. Make sure you get paid on time. Make sure you get paid in advanced. Make sure you are asking people for money to buy something from you. Make sure that you are consistently out there following up your opportunities and posing those opportunities. Those things make cash really fast in most businesses. That’s simple cash flow. That’s probably about a quarter of in a nutshell a quarter of an entire strategy but I say to people if you spent one hour a day in your business focusing on income generating activity, and that’s a primary activity where you physically engage someone or you offer something where somebody can buy something from you will never be out of money again in your business if that was what your focus was. One hour a day is going to make a huge difference.

John McIntyre a:I love this and I think the best part about it is that … I read recently. A podcast just went out with Perry Marshall recently on his book of E80/20 Sales and Marketing and part of the realization on that book for me is you can take some of the smallest activity, the smallest tasks on your to do list that will produce the biggest results and it’s actually encouraging you start to isolate these activities you can work less and make more money, make more impact, get more done and this is one of those things.

John:Absolutely, absolutely. The second part of that strategy a lot of people say, “I don’t have invoices. I don’t clients that I can just go and offer things to.” I’m scratching around for opportunity. They think by the time they build a relationship with somebody, go through a sales process, sit down with them, make an offer that’s going to take time and I sit there say, “Listen, every single person knows somebody who’s in business.” If you can’t buy coffee you know the guy who runs a coffee store. If you a family member, an associate, a colleague, a class mate, people you bump into, business cards you’ve collected along the way, everybody can roughly get a list of between 60 and 130 people. The average person has got about 130 people on their Facebook pages. Everybody has got a list right now who’s in business of people that are either are in business or people that know someone who is in business.

I say to those people, “Here’s what you want to do. Get that list together as quickly as possible, preferably if you can get an email list that will be even better of people, if you can get an email list you are going to go direct to these people, right?” Really I tell people how often have you told people that you know what you do and how you do what you do? How often have you educated those people around you so that if they know somebody that needs help around that area they can refer people to you. People refer people to people all the time.

I sat there and said, “This is the strategy. All you’ve got to do is say, “Hey mom, dad, brother, sister, friend, cousin, business owner. We’ve had a connection. I know you. This is what I do. This is how I help people. This is the type of results that I can get for people and this is what I’m doing.” If you or anybody you know needs some help in this area, do you mind just passing this on?” Pretty simple.

I have …

John McIntyre a:I’m getting excited.

John:I had a person who took this strategy to heart, took this and said, “Hey, I need some cash and I need it now.” He sat there and he wrote down an email list. I think he ended up with an email list of about 60 people that he could go out to and he made  very simple offer. He was in web development and his focus was to actually blow up sites and actually converted and engaged customers when they visited. He had a focus in conversion based websites that he could develop. He had a system strategy. It worked really well. He knew he could deliver really well but nobody really knew exactly what he did.

He told friends and family. He said, “Listen, this is what I’m going to do. He sent an email out, made an offer.” He said, “I’m just looking for a handful of people who will take advantage of this.” It was a good offer that made some profit for him. By the end of the day he had four people that said yes, I’ll take you up on the offer. Sixteen thousand dollars in a day from people who they knew, knew from the past purely by just putting something out there.

One thing that I find with people is all you’ve got to do is ask. Let people know, hey I need some help. Do you know anybody that needs help with this sort of thing and you’ll be surprised at how many people will come to you.

John McIntyre a:You are absolutely right. The reason I’m getting excited is I’ve got this autoresponder to me site. The daily emails that goes out and pushes people to the product and the how to write an autoresponder. What I haven’t done and I don’t have a list for because they never went through a web or they never physically signed up to an email list is a list of all the clients that we create an autorespond for. Basically, you are saying what we should do and I know this has worked because I’ve done small sample size, filed 10 people on this sometimes when I’m ringing some cash but I’ve never actually gone through every client I’ve ever worked with, grab their email address because it’s all via email and then sent them all saying, “We are doing autoresponse now, we can do a product launch and we can do this and that,” and I know that if I did this, this afternoon, maybe I’ll do it. There is going to be sales. This is the money straightaway like that. You are talking about putting a people via link in the email, right.

John:Yeah, absolutely, buy now, here it is, take advantage of it. Yeah. The other method that you are talking about, you talked about earlier on and this is a very simple strategy is something that every email marketer knows but the actual focus of this strategy is to run a very small sequence to either reignite existing clients, passed connections and contacts into a fast decision making sales process. The key here is to come up with a fantastic offer, the best offer that you can imagine or think up. It has to make money for you. You are not going to go out there and run a loss lead or run a low end campaign or a low end price point. You are looking for something that has good cost, has great value, maybe you’ve padded in with some added value items to build up the value of the actual opportunity but you’ve got to make some money out of it.

You’ve got to make some cash. There’s no point in doing something for nothing. You are going to do the work. You want to make some opportunity for revenue and for profit. You build the software. You create an awesome offer and you say, “Hey, I’ve [inaudible 00:21:13] that. Overall, you’ve made a mistake or we’ve got capacity. We’ve got room to help two or three people to take advantage of something very unique that we’ve put together. We are only offering this to a handful of people. You are one of the handful of people that are being offered this to. If you’d like to take advantage of it let us know straightaway. We can get this action. We’ve got some space to next two weeks, right.

Time sensitive, quantity sensitive. Scarcity is a powerful motivator. Good reason, great value so awesome offer. Remember these people you are sending to are people you already know or who are already existing clients. You don’t need to sell them on case studies and who you do things for and what great results you get for people. They already know who you are. They already know what results you get, right of your product or service.

It’s a relatively familiar list. Even past contacts, people you just bumped into. They know who you are but you’ve never done business with them. These are people you put into this campaign. First email, awesome offer. Second email, day two, right. Most companies or most businesses especially offline they only send out one offer and that’s it. They get limited results, right and so conversions are low, nothing ever happens. The second email is a very second email. The headline I just want to make sure you got this so you didn’t miss out, that’s it and then it reiterates the offer, the awesome value, the awesome thing. I’ve added what four or five of these available, just click here take advantage of now, let’s do it.

Third day, day three next email, hey we’d love to know what you thought about this unique offer. We’d love to know what your feedback on what you think about the value or what you thought about this. Again, reiterate the offer, time sensitive, time limited.

The last offer are you interested, would you like to ahead with this offer? Four emails, very simple sequence. First email of that offer. Second email, just make sure you are getting this offer. Third email we’d love to know what you thought about this awesome offer. Last email, are you interested in taking advantage of this?

Generally with time we will run these types of campaigns especially to offline clients and even in business when I’ve tested these campaigns invariably we always make the sale. Somebody in your list is going to buy something. Somebody is ready. Even if you sold one you still made a deal out of this because you are making a profit. 

In this campaign, this is where can I get really sexy with you John?

John McIntyre a:Go for it man. I love the sexy.

John:Here we go really sexy with this. Everybody who’s in the email marketing game knows in the autorespondense, in the reporting we can actually see the clicking activity or the open rate and not only that we can actually see how many times they open up an email, yeah. We can see those figures and results. Using [inaudible 00:23:47] we can actually see how many people open up an email. We found that when can actually see a person open up an email, open up an email more than once it shows that whatever they headline is, whatever the subject line is and the email has sparked an interest, enough of an interest for them to open an email twice.

Because most of these lists are not huge we say to the people, just give the person a call and say, “Hey, we notice that you’ve had a look at the offer, is there anything we can help you with,” or, “Is there something we can explain about what we are offering and why we are offering this?” That’s the kicker. The kicker is that they can follow up based on the behavior, people who have opened up the email two or three times. We’ve seen conversion rates in sales improve by up to 33 percent purely by picking up the phone and saying, “Hey, I noticed you had a look at that thing twice. What can we help you with or is anything we can help you with around that?

It’s really simple. Most people don’t pick up the phone but you’ve got a reason to do it. It’s a really simple thing to do. I’ve done this campaign. Probably the best result that I’ve had with this campaign is a list of 62 people generate $250,000 in the IT sector. This was to a knowledge manage company that was selling Intranet database knowledge management  systems. They got about 250 grand worth of work from a list of 62 people running this exact campaign in that format with the follow up call.

John McIntyre a:I like that. I like that. That dial up per subscriber value was insane right there.

John:It was awesome. The thing again and here’s can we get really sexy now?

John McIntyre a:Let’s do it. Let’s go John.

John:Let’s go really … let’s really low down and dirty on this one. This is where you get a little kinky. You run the campaign. The campaign is run [inaudible 00:25:23]. What you do now is you go back, pick a handful of that people at that list and say, “Hey, we run this thing. We got a few people. Took advantage of this thing. Just want to know if you saw it. Can we just walk you through what we would do there and what we are offering?” It’s amazing the people say, “I saw something not quite sure,” or, “Yes, saw that thing. We weren’t quite ready yet.” You say, “Look, I’ll tell you what because you’ve taken the time to answer the call and answer the questions, what if we made the offer to you? Would you like to go ahead?”

We’ve seen sales of campaign running three weeks later. I work with a wholesale IT company that sells hardware and logistics. We did that strategy on a campaign that had already been gone for three weeks. People had pretty much forgotten about the campaign. We devised an amazing strategy. We got the sales guys to just do that. “Hey, run this thing a few weeks ago, not sure if you remember it. It was a pretty good we had a lot of people take advantage but know that … just wanted to know was that something that was cool for you guys and what did you think about the deal? Here’s what the deal was.” They run read out the deal and said, “Hey, if you want to we, we can do it for you.” They picked up 17 sales. The average sale was 32 grand.

Offer back ending, remember the old follow up old quotes. This is following up all the emails. The email had gone. It was just going back picking a handful of people and just saying, “Hey, how are you doing? We’ve still got some stuff available if you’d love to take advantage of it. Just would love to know what you thought about that campaign.”

John McIntyre a:This reminds me the quote. The always be closing.

John:Absolutely, yeah it is. It is always be closing … old sales quote always be closing.

John McIntyre a:Always be closing. It’s just so simple. You just got to talk to more people and make more offers.

John:Absolutely, a lot of people forget in this game especially with direct response and with communication it’s important that we are so distracted, we are so disjointed with what we are being bombarded with. I’m walking into stores with my iPhone, looking at buying a pair of sneakers and I’m looking at the website of a store that’s diagonally 20 minutes way. Here I am. I’m focused, I’ve gotten in the store but I’m checking our prices or I’m checking out shoes on another store just down the road from where I’m standing.

We are so caught up, we are so bombarded that we forget that I love the concept or Google came up with this concept a little while ago called the zero moment of truth or ZMOT. You can even Google it. They’ve got videos on it but they were saying back in 2009 the average person would take five frames of reference before they made a purchasing decision. Five frames of reference was talking to a friend, checking out an ad, hopping on the Internet to check the website looking at the product online. They were five frames of reference a person would buy.

Today we are talking, five years later, people on average are looking for 18 points of reference before they make a purchasing decision and if I talk about that shoe example as a perfect example. 

I was looking for a comfortable pair of sneakers. We’ve got heaps of store around the world like Foot Locker or Hypedc and all these stores that sell sneakers. It’s quite a trendy thing to do. I was looking for something comfortable. I hop online, I do my research. I type in cool, comfy, casual sneakers. Search comes up I get regular stores. Foot Locker, Hypedc, Nordstrom and a few others in that search. I look, I go and have a look and see what sort of funky sneakers they’ve got. I’ve done the search. I know connect with five websites. I’ve hit five websites. There’s five, search is six. I don’t click on three different searches because I’m looking for more than just cool sneakers.

Search is six. I eventually sit down and say, hey, I go into a store. I walk into two different stores. I go to a Hypedc store, I go to a Foot Locker store. I’m sitting there, looking at their shops. I’m already up to nine frames of reference before I’ve even purchased a product. Then I try a product on. I take a photograph of the product on my foot with my iPhone and I SMS it to my wife and say, “Hey honey, what do you think of this?” And she SMSes back, “You look pretty good. Is it comfortable?” I said, “Yeah, great.”

There I’m asking for another frame of reference before I make the purchase not based on whether I liked it or not but does it look cool, what it looks like. Understand that if people looking for that many frames or references to make a purchasing decision, if you think you are going to go out there and do a one shot deal, and think that people are just going to fall over themselves and say, “Yes, I’m going to make that happen,” you are kidding yourself. You’ve got to be in your customers face on a consistent basis. 

You’ve got to be engaging them, nurturing them, hitting them from different angles, offline, online and if it’s big volume sales and big dollar sales them you need to be spending the time and building that relationship. We are learning from the Amazons and the eBay’s and the Ace Horses and these guys are doing amazing work online. They are almost literally saying, “Hey, I’m an online business but I want you to feel like we are offline.” They are building this amazing relationship by sending out offers.

If you go to their websites, all their websites are full of offers. The first thing you see, 20 percent off this, here get this deal, get into this VIP program you’ll get better deals if you join this thing. They are teaching us. They are showing us what is working and I think this is where businesses get stuck, they get caught up in all the bullshit in their business of not making money, they are struggling. They are not targeting the right clients. They don’t even know their customers well enough and they are seeing businesses that have only started three or four years ago absolutely killing it in their market.

We’ve got a great magazine in Australia, well not a magazine. It’s an online magazine now but the publishing world is being stricken by the online bug but BOW runs a list of the fasted growing companies every year, the top 100 fastest growing businesses. The average business in there they started five year ago. They are only very young. The most successful business in this particular group was a retailer, an offline retailer. You would think an online retailer would do better. This is an offline retailer. This offline retailer started the business in 2009. From 2009 to now 2014 they are generating a turnover of $63 million in revenue in five years.

Here’s the thing here, in the last 12 months they went from 30 million to 63. They doubled because of online marketing and because of online and also direct response offline as well with their customers. People in the retail industry who’ve been around for 20 years they heard him. All over a sudden, this nobody out of nowhere says, “Hey, I want to be a retailer to. I want to sell some great products. I want to create a great customer experience. I’m coming in here late,” and so most people just say, “Hey, you’ve been late because the bubbles just about to burst with online marketing online retail. Why are you opening up an offline store?” And all over a sudden they are killing it out there.

I think people don’t ask for enough, they don’t focus on what they want to generate and achieve in their business and they are not maximizing their opportunities.

John McIntyre a:I think too. Once you get  the hang of marketing, once you really get how marketing works and how it’s really quite simple with the making of the offers and all that stuff that you can go into any market. When you are good at it, as long as you assess the environment well enough you can go into anywhere and make money.

John:Yeah, absolutely. Know your customers. Find out they want, give it to them as much as you can, make it easy for them to buy.

John McIntyre a:It’s something to do with the whole entrepreneurial mindset here which is really that there’s no problem that can’t be solved. That’s really what makes a entrepreneur is that everyone else is saying, “No, you can’t do that. It’ll never work. There’s no way anyone is going to do that,” and then they just go and figure it out. When you go to do it and they do it.

John:Absolutely, give it a try and go for it. I think a lot of people do marketing back to front. They think about their product offering and their product and what it does rather than thinking about the person who is actually going to buy it and use it. It’s almost reverse marketing and I sit there and say, “Hey, don’t fall in love with the product. Fall in love with the customer that’s going to receive this product and benefit from the product.” If you can fall in love with those sorts of people then the communication, the engagement you are going create from that is going to serve you so much better than thinking about how can I get this stuff out.

John McIntyre a:I love that but I think that’s a good note to end on John. Before we go give though the listeners are wondering where can they get a little more about you or about the consulting, the mentoring stuff you do, any of that stuff.

John:They can go to makeeverydayapayday.com. There’s a blog there. They can get a lot of videos and information off of what’s strategies, and tactics and ideas, and lots of free training on there. I also run a podcast like you at businessunleashed.com with my partner, Chris Green in the UK and that’s a realistic and practical and tactical ideas, [inaudible 00:33:52] you can generate revenue from pretty much what we said today on your podcast.

John McIntyre a:Sounds good. I’ll let links to that at the [inaudible 00:33:58] McMastersmethod.com and one thing you mentioned before we jumped on this call is the song, the [inaudible 00:34:03] song. If you are listening and you want to know what this song is you can go to the McMasters.com. It’s on every single podcast post and you’ll be able to see that on there.

John thanks for coming on the show man.

John:Thanks John. I appreciate you having me on.