#201 – Ken Goldberg on why your robot butler isn’t here yet
Sep 13, 2024
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In this insightful discussion, Ken Goldberg, a renowned robotics professor at UC Berkeley and co-founder of innovative startups, shares his expertise on the future of robots in our lives. He outlines why training robots is more challenging than training language models and explores engineering hurdles that must be overcome for practical applications. Ken highlights sectors like homecare, agriculture, and medicine where robots could thrive. He reassures listeners about the continuing importance of human roles in workplaces amid automation's rise.
Ken Goldberg highlights the complex challenges in robotics, particularly the difficulties in perception and manipulation in physical environments.
Robots face significant hurdles in learning human-like physical actions, emphasizing the disparity between language processing and robotic movement capabilities.
The logistics and agriculture sectors present strong opportunities for robotic integration, especially as demand for efficient operations increases.
While robotics shows promise in surgery, it remains challenging due to the precise nature of medical procedures and human anatomy complexities.
Deep dives
Understanding Degrees of Freedom in Robotics
The concept of degrees of freedom is vital in robotics, where objects in space possess six degrees—three for position and three for orientation. This increases significantly when considering complex objects like hands, which may have as many as 20 degrees of freedom due to their multiple joints and movements. As more degrees of freedom are added, the dimensionality of the space increases exponentially, leading to greater complexity in movements. In contrast, language is a one-dimensional linear structure with a limited vocabulary, highlighting the disparity between language constructs and the intricate motions in robotics.
Current State and Expectations of Robotics
Robotics is experiencing a wave of optimism fueled by advancements in AI and machine learning, but experts caution against overinflated expectations. There are significant challenges that remain unsolved, particularly in areas that require intricate manipulation and understanding of physical environments. Progress is being made in specific applications, such as logistics and drone technology, but experts argue that general-purpose robotic capabilities are further away than often perceived. Furthermore, there's concern that inflated expectations could lead to a backlash if the anticipated advances do not materialize within a given timeframe.
The Limitations of Robotics in Learning and Perception
While robots have made strides in mimicking human language through learning algorithms, replicating human-like physical actions remains a complex challenge. Unlike language, where large datasets enable the model to interpolate patterns, a robot's ability to learn from videos of human actions lacks sufficient data and context to accurately translate that knowledge into physical movements. The dimensionality of tasks—such as grasping objects, which requires fine motor control—is vastly more intricate than generating textual responses, resulting in a disparity in the progress of these fields. This intrinsic complexity emphasizes the need for continued research in understanding human movements and improving robotic capabilities.
Challenges in Object Manipulation and Context Awareness
Robots often struggle with tasks that require the understanding of context and manipulation of soft or complex objects. For instance, managing a delicate task like cracking an egg requires precise coordination that current robots struggle to replicate due to their rigid control systems. In contrast, human dexterity benefits from a wide range of tactile feedback and a nuanced understanding of forces at play. This challenge showcases the limitations of current robotic systems and highlights the necessity of developing models that can adapt to real-world unpredictability.
Future Applications in Logistics and Agriculture
The logistics sector presents an imminent opportunity for robotic integration, particularly due to the increase in online shopping and the need for efficient package handling. Robots are being employed to sort, lift, and move packages within warehouses, with advancements allowing them to operate successfully in these environments. In agriculture, the integration of robots is also expected to grow as the industry faces a shortage of labor and increased demand for efficient harvesting methods. Innovations in robotic systems could enable tasks like watering, pruning, and managing complex plant growth, ultimately increasing productivity and sustainability.
Surgery and Augmented Dexterity with Robots
The field of surgery is beginning to experience the influence of robotics, particularly with the development of systems designed to assist surgeons rather than replace them. By enhancing a surgeon's dexterity and precision, robotic tools are being integrated into operations to improve outcomes, such as suturing wounds more effectively. However, challenges persist, mainly due to the complexity of human anatomy and the need for high levels of precision and judicious application of force. Future progress may offer augmented systems that leverage both human expertise and robotic efficiency to enhance patient care.
Art and Robotics: A Reflection of Humanity
The intersection of art and robotics offers a unique platform for exploring and critiquing the capabilities and perceptions of robots in society. Projects like the Telegarden demonstrate how public interactions with robotic systems can yield unforeseen social dynamics, such as the 'tragedy of the commons' phenomenon. Additionally, collaborations between robotic arms and dancers showcase the creativity of human movement contrasted against the rigidity of robotic motion. Such artistic endeavors not only provoke thought about the future role of robots but also celebrate the unparalleled complexity of human experience and expression.
"Perception is quite difficult with cameras: even if you have a stereo camera, you still can’t really build a map of where everything is in space. It’s just very difficult. And I know that sounds surprising, because humans are very good at this. In fact, even with one eye, we can navigate and we can clear the dinner table. But it seems that we’re building in a lot of understanding and intuition about what’s happening in the world and where objects are and how they behave. For robots, it’s very difficult to get a perfectly accurate model of the world and where things are. So if you’re going to go manipulate or grasp an object, a small error in that position will maybe have your robot crash into the object, a delicate wine glass, and probably break it. So the perception and the control are both problems." —Ken Goldberg
In today’s episode, host Luisa Rodriguez speaks to Ken Goldberg — robotics professor at UC Berkeley — about the major research challenges still ahead before robots become broadly integrated into our homes and societies.
