Few events inspire a media spectacle quite like the election of a pope. The white smoke, cardinals locked in the Sistine Chapel, secret ballots and ancient rules—it’s catnip for secular and Catholic journalists alike. But how did these customs evolve—and how might they change in the future?

To find out, Zac and Ashley talk with Miles Pattenden, a historian, expert in the history of papal conclaves and the author of Electing the Pope in Early Modern Italy, 1450-1700.

They discuss:

How the election of popes evolved from St. Peter to today

The role of the Holy Spirit—and politicking—inside conclaves

And whether the secrecy of conclaves can survive in a modern world that prizes transparency

In Signs of the Times, Zac and Ashley discuss a new Justice Department investigation into last year’s leaked F.B.I. memo about the potential domestic threat posed by “traditional Catholics.” Plus, in a talk about forgiveness, a Michigan bishop called on Catholics not to “hate” politicians like Joe Biden—and then called the president stupid.

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Links from the show:

No Bias Found in F.B.I. Report on Catholic Extremists

Biden ‘doesn't understand the Catholic faith,’ bishop says: ‘I’m not angry at him, he’s just stupid’

Electing the Pope in Early Modern Italy, 1450-1700, by Miles Pattenden

MilesPattenden.com

What’s on tap?

Amaro Spritz

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