In a profound discussion with Yascha Mounk, renowned anthropologist James C. Scott reflects on the perils of state power. He challenges the notion of state benevolence, urging listeners to rethink its historical role and often exploitative nature. Scott delves into the resilience of Myanmar's youth-led democratic movement, offering insight into the country's struggles under military rule. He also entertains the idea of giving 'two cheers' for anarchism, emphasizing the necessity to advocate for more equitable social democracies amidst capitalist challenges.
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Quick takeaways
James C. Scott emphasizes the historical role of states as extractive entities, often prioritizing wealth over the welfare of individuals and communities.
The ongoing resistance in Myanmar illustrates a significant commitment to nonviolent change among younger generations despite severe repression from the military.
Deep dives
The Unsustainable Growth of Western States
Western states have achieved their current prosperity by exploiting global resources for industrial growth, leading to unsustainable practices and significant collateral damage. This paradigm of economic development has contributed to environmental degradation, increased carbon emissions, and various forms of human bondage, painting a bleak picture of capitalist success. The historical context reveals that successful capitalist nations often overlook the lasting impacts of such growth on both the environment and marginalized populations. This critique calls for a deeper understanding of how seemingly successful states are intricately linked to systemic exploitation and unsustainable practices.
Skepticism Toward State Power
The skepticism surrounding state power arises from the historical role of states primarily as entities of extraction and control rather than as instruments of public welfare. Modern welfare systems, such as those in Denmark, are relatively recent developments in the long history of states that aimed to maximize wealth extraction from their populations. Even when states implement emancipatory policies, they often do so under pressure, suggesting that genuine concern for individual welfare is not the primary motivator. Thus, recognizing the state's legacy of prioritizing extraction over empowerment remains crucial in evaluating contemporary governance.
The Illusions of Urban Planning
Urban planning often fails to align with the needs and realities of human existence, leading to spaces that, despite appearing efficient, do not foster genuine community engagement. Examples like Brasilia illustrate how top-down planning can result in sterile environments that lack functionality and vibrancy, contrasting with organically developed urban spaces like old cities that thrive on their intricate, lived-in chaos. The misguided belief that visual order denotes efficiency neglects the complex social lives that make urban areas thrive, as evidenced by neighborhoods that grow spontaneously and serve the community effectively. This critique of planning emphasizes the necessity of involving local populations in the creation of public spaces to ensure they reflect and support community dynamics.
The Complicated Political Landscape in Myanmar
Myanmar's political landscape has been dramatically impacted by decades of military rule, which has suppressed democratic practices and resulted in widespread isolation from the global community. The recent military coup has prompted a mass uprising, primarily among younger generations, who are demonstrating a commendable commitment to nonviolent resistance despite facing severe repression from the military. Although the military's brutal response casts a shadow on the prospects for successful democratic reform, the ongoing resistance indicates a profound desire for change. Supporting the democratic movement, even amid its complexities and the ambiguous legacy of figures like Aung San Suu Kyi, highlights the necessity of solidarity in the face of authoritarianism.
In one of his final extended interviews, which was recorded three years before his recent death, the late anthropologist James C. Scott and Yascha Mounk discuss the need to be vigilant about the ways in which states do violence to individuals and societies.
James C. Scott was the Sterling professor of political science and anthropology at Yale University. Scott is the author of major works including Seeing Like a State: How Certain Schemes to Improve the Human Condition Have Failed and Against the Grain: A Deep History of the Earliest States.
In this week’s conversation, Yascha Mounk and James Scott discuss whether we ought to give "two cheers" for anarchism, why the state is here to stay, and the ongoing crisis in Myanmar.