I think one of the ways we have to defeat this popularism polarization post truth thing is actually to rewind the argument for facts to be at the heart of debate. You may reach a point, we haven't mentioned Al Gore, but I think Al Gore's Phil, an inconvenient truth, which was a brilliant piece of educative polemic,. if you like. But that case has to be made again and again and again or it won't work. So I would still want to see it all rooted in the science. And more I think you've got to shape people's complacency about everything. Will unbelievably complacent about everything. This isn't worth campaigning on now. It

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