Intro

Revered by some, vilified by others, Ibram X. Kendi is America's most controversial anti-racism scholar. In this wide-ranging and frank conversation, the bestselling author of How to Be an Anti-Racist discusses his foundational (and republished) 2012 book The Black Campus Movement, drawing parallels between 1960s student activism and today's Gaza protests. Kendi argues critics deliberately misrepresent his work to "make me into this boogeyman" and keep people from engaging with evidence-based scholarship on racism. Despite facing accusations of being a "fraud," Kendi remains committed to his mission, particularly in his upcoming role at Howard University, where he'll direct a new Institute for Advanced Study.

Five Key Takeaways

* History Repeating: Kendi argues that today's campus protests over Gaza mirror 1960s Black student activism, with opponents using similar talking points to undermine anti-racist efforts on college campuses.

* The "Boogeyman" Strategy: Kendi believes his critics deliberately misrepresent his work to make him seem "scary" and keep people from engaging with his evidence-based scholarship on racism, rather than addressing his actual arguments.

* Campus Activism Then vs. Now: Key differences between the 1960s and today include the federal government now working to "re-segregate" campuses rather than desegregate them, and the presence of campus police forces that can suppress demonstrations.

* Indirect Racism: Kendi argues that modern racism operates indirectly—when people deny that racist policies exist while racial disparities persist, they're implicitly suggesting that Black people are inferior, just without saying it explicitly.

* New Chapter at Howard: After facing controversy and criticism, Kendi is moving from Boston University to historically Black Howard University to direct a new Institute for Advanced Study focused on rigorously studying racism.

DR. IBRAM X. KENDI is a National Book Award-winning author of seventeen books for adults and children, including eleven New York Times bestsellers. Dr. Kendi is the Andrew W. Mellon Professor in the Humanities at Boston University, and the director of the BU Center for Antiracist Research. In the summer of 2025, he will join Howard University as Professor of History and Director of its newly established Howard Institute for Advanced Study. Dr. Kendi is the author of Stamped from the Beginning: The Definitive History of Racist Ideas in America, which won the National Book Award for Nonfiction, making him the youngest author to win that award. He also authored the international bestseller, How to Be an Antiracist, which was described in the New York Times as “the most courageous book to date on the problem of race in the Western mind.” Dr. Kendi’s other bestsellers include How to Raise an Antiracist and Antiracist Baby, illustrated by Ashley Lukashevsky. In 2020, Time magazine named Dr. Kendi one of the 100 Most Influential People in the world. He was awarded a 2021 MacArthur Fellowship, popularly known as the Genius Grant. His newest book is Malcolm Lives! It is the first major biography of Malcolm for young readers in more than thirty years. It appeared in May 2025 on the centennial of Malcolm’s birth and debuted on the New York Times bestseller list.

Named as one of the "100 most connected men" by GQ magazine, Andrew Keen is amongst the world's best known broadcasters and commentators. In addition to presenting the daily KEEN ON show, he is the host of the long-running How To Fix Democracy interview series. He is also the author of four prescient books about digital technology: CULT OF THE AMATEUR, DIGITAL VERTIGO, THE INTERNET IS NOT THE ANSWER and HOW TO FIX THE FUTURE. Andrew lives in San Francisco, is married to Cassandra Knight, Google's VP of Litigation & Discovery, and has two grown children.

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