i think when you're getting started, to me, it was really helpful just to be kind of grateful that somebody gave me a job. The desire to get good at something that i had never done before has now helped me in everything else i've ever done. I he ryan: What was your personal turning point or moment where you began this sort of stoic journey? joe i: When i was 19 or 20 years old, and i had just asked someone for a book recommendation, and that's how i got turned into stoicism.

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