Cellular Cognition and Scale

What are the best competing theories of consciousness? Can we isolate where it arises and measure how complex it is? How do 5meo DMT mystical or non-separation experiences shift worldviews on consciousness?

In this episode we have the very theme of the podcast’s title to delve into, the quest to understand the nature of consciousness. So we discuss mind and self, and what kind of substrate you need to allow for subjective experience; we look at the various philosophical positions on the nature of consciousness and ways to move beyond the unwinnable argument around the hard problem; we talk about extended cognition and cellular cognition; how integrated information theory attempts to quantify consciousness; the origin of meaning; psychedelics and the implications of mystical experiences of non-separation; whether AI will ever become conscious; and the implications of plant intelligence and memory.

There’s only one person who can speak about such a wide range of topics this well, one of the most passionate consciousness researchers in the world for over 40 years, physicist and neuroscientist, Christof Koch. He’s Chief Scientist at the BlueDot Foundation, and has authored and co-authored over 1000 scientific papers and 6 books, including “The Quest for Consciousness”, “Confessions of a Romantic Reductionst” and “Then I am myself the World”, which we’ll be focussing on today. 

What we discuss:

00:00 His migration from physics to neuroscience.

06:10 “Take no one’s word for it”.

07:50 His long-term Francis Crick collaboration.

10:00 The signatures, footprints and correlates of consciousness.

17:50 The empirical approach to the philosophical ‘Hard problem’.

21:00 Metaphysics isn’t empirical.

21:40 The issues along the spectrum from materialism to idealism.

29:00 “The great divide of being” - quotidian vs dissociated states.

33:15 Is the self an illusion?

34:15 The difference between self consciousness and subjective experience.

38:00 “Confessions of a romantic reductionist”.

41:00 Meaning is not an empirical subject.

44:30 Integrated information theory explained - existence as casual power.

52:50 The placebo effect is consciousness causally influencing the world.

01:00:00 Computational theories of consciousness.

01:03:10 The connectome: an exact brain replica in a simulation.

01:05:10 Extended cognition & the blurred boundaries between selves.

01:09:30 Michael Levin: the hierarchy from cellular to collective cognition.

01:13:50 ‘Then I am myself the world’ Book.

01:14:40 5meoDMT: His mystical & NDE experiences.

01:21:40 Lowering of the DMN in non-self like experiences like flow, meditation, day-dreaming, or psychedelics.

01:24:00 To be real, experiences must have causal power.

01:27:25 Perspective shift after psychedelics.

01:30:50 Plant consciousness, intelligence, communication & memory.

References: 

www.christofkoch.com

Scientific Papers

Christof Koch, “Then I Am Myself the World: What Consciousness Is and How to Expand It the world”.

Christof Koch, “Consciousness: Confessions of a romantic reductionist.”