In today's podcast, I am joined by my friends Kyle Thiermann, Chris Ryan and Mark Healey for witty banter, philosophizing, and intellectually stimulating conversation straight from the island of Hawaii, where we - along with several others mentioned in this podcast episode, such as Dr. Peter Attia, Kyle Kingsbury and Hawaii hunting guide Justin Lee - took a break from hunting, hiking, spearfishing and dressing meat to gather round the podcasting mics.

In this conversation, you'll hear... -Recap of the trip...6:47

Chris was a last minute substitute
Primal surroundings: goat head in the back of the pickup
They were all dropped off by helicopter on various spots on the Big Island
Ben engaged in spearfishing; caught Hawaiian lobster, opi'i fish
Impossible to replicate their meals in a restaurant

-Ben is asked about consuming energy bars while facing dehydration...12:17

If you're in an extreme dehydration situation, you're probably starving to death, so don't throw them out
They could potentially be used as a water filter because they're so thick
Coffee and beer don't actually dehydrate you
Energy bars have moisture in them
Depends on salt content, moisture level, etc.

-How ranchers on the island of Kaho'olawe used goats to prevent sharks from attacking their herd...14:05

Sharks would attack as they were loaded onto ships for transport
Ranchers pushed a herd of goats tied to each other off a cliff
The cattle was transported while the sharks feasted on the goats

-Discussion about the sustainability of humans hunting their own meat in the modern world...15:30

Hunting is necessary in Hawai'i for sustainability of the land
It's not cheaper when you factor in ammo, time spent hunting, obtaining permits, etc.
Large amounts of money from hunting is invested into environmental sustainability
Eradication vs. management
Killing an animal is a deeply personal experience
- Everyone who eats meat should hunt at least once
We are what we eat: cruelty, apathy, torture, etc.

-How do our thoughts shape our health?...

Book: The Biology of Belief by Dr. Bruce Lipton
Book: Mind to Matter by Dr. Dawson Church
Epigenetics: Behavior of parents/ancestors affects their children's behavior and instincts
Do humans have instincts?
- Going for the nipple
- Fear of snakes
- "Comparing notes" after a hunt separated humans from other animals
- Coordinated hunting

-Our understanding of human history as it pertains to resilience toward stress...

Research suggests we become more sensitive to stress rather than more resilient
Chronic stressors (business responsibilities) our ancestors didn't deal with
Experiencing stress without realizing it, or thinking you're relaxed
- Practice makes automatic
Difference between stress and excitement
Alpha vs. beta brain waves
- Alpha: what you experience in "the flow"; familiar, happy, focused
- Beta: Higher level of excitement; less predictability
Parasympathetic vs. sympathetic nervous system
- Sympathetic: fight and flight nervous system
- Parasympathetic: rest and digestive nervous system
- Vagus nerve feeds into the sinoatrial node of the heart
You want high heart rate variability (HRV)
- Vagus nerve is operating the parasympathetic system properly
Meditating, chanting, cold water assist with maintaining high HRV

-How stress affects rigor mortis (in hunted game) and cramping

Deer reach rigor mortis in 20 minutes when corralled (stressed) and over an hour when killed in the wild
You cramp in stressful situations while exercising due to calcium release
Sour, spicy taste overrides neuronal reflex
Golgi tendon organ limits the contraction, but is overridden by neuronal reflex
- Other animals don't have this, and put far more stress on their muscles
- When mom lifts a car to save the baby, the brain, because of extreme stress, overrides the golgi tendon organ
- Brain over brawn: why humans have the golgi tendon organ and other animals don't

-The evolving understanding of convenience vs. an appreciation of our history...

Infant formula: no colostrum, fatty acid,
Breast milk is a fatty, highly addictive food; you'd be obese if you drank it all your life
The microbiome is a gift to the environmental movement
- Your surroundings impact your gut health

-Is bottled water really cleaner and safer than tap water?...

FDA treats bottled water as a food product; tap water is treated as water, so it's tested far more often
Chlorine, fluoride is in the tap water
Bottled water comes from a filtered source

-Why Hawai'i is so freaking amazing...

Hawai'i had cattle ranchers before California
Beach as well as mountain culture
Cultural holocaust: Christian missionaries
Hawaiian language stayed alive in the cattle ranchers:
- It was more functional
- Perhaps reflective of the number of colors, sights and scents in Hawai'i
- Akin to why podcasts are popular: you can break down concepts you can't on CNN

-How Mark Healy narrowly escaped death while surfing in Fiji...

Grew up on North Shore of Oahu; got noticed by important surfer dudes
Ended up going to Fiji for his first professional trip at age 14; had visualized Fiji for years
Was in one of the most iconic surfing photos in history

-Is Nature really the violent, nasty, brutish force we're led to believe it is?...

Hobbes: Everything eats life
Things that appear to be important are not in evolutionary terms
- Human chin - where two bones come together
An arrow is a much better way to die than dying in nature
We speak of death as though it's not going to happen
- Non-Western cultures celebrate death
- Perhaps explains animosity surrounding hunting

-Differing perspectives on how we relate our life experiences to others...

Narrative: knowing which dots to connect, and what to leave out
Being present and in the moment vs. on auto-pilot
Writing the story before it happens
Specificity is key. Too much information is overwhelming, prevents people from taking action (for example, charity donations)

-The role of fire and water in the history of human evolution...

Source of food, amusement, protection, comfort
Movement of fire is reflected in the nature of human consciousness
They can alter landscapes, be very destructive
Large swaths of the Amazon have been cleared by fire
Podcasts around a fire never work well
Water is the greatest source of "awe" that we know of

-Perceived scarcity vs. real scarcity...

People with nothing live as though they have everything. People with everything live as though there's not enough
Perspective, born of experience, helps to understand the disparity between real and perceived scarcity
We spend money to isolate ourselves from others as soon as we get it
Inconvenience puts you in touch with other people (hitch-hiking, taking the bus)

-Mark describes his business, Healy Water Ops...

Many of the clients are very wealthy and successful in business and life
They know a red herring when they see or hear it
They enjoy having Mark run the show, tell them what to do; it allows them to relax for a bit

-Running a business, unschooling, and why we need to restore boredom in our culture...

Treat your business like a big dog; assert dominance
We don't have boredom anymore with social media, smartphones, etc.
Silence often precedes a maturation in a relationship
Learn how to hunt without a guide; self-taught
Allow kids to work out conflict on their own
Preventive medicine

-And much more. Resources From this Episode:

-Book: The Biology of Belief by Dr. Bruce Lipton

-Book: Mind to Matter by Dr. Dawson Church

-Kion Energy Bars

-Kion Coffee

-Podcast: 32 Ways to Stimulate Your Vagus Nerve, Fine-Tune Your Nervous System & Self-Hack Your Hormones

-Article: The History of Hawaiian Cowboys

-About the Hawaiian Language

-Book: Ni'ihau: The Last Hawaiian Island

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