Increasing Indifference and Polarization

We discuss the growing gender divide between political parties, especially among youth. Men are trending more conservative while women trend more progressive/liberal. We cover theories on sexual gatekeeping, bureaucratic optimization, and relationship breakdown driving this divide. We also touch on whether masculine parties can succeed given bureaucracy, the decline of democracy in the U.S., and the road towards autocracy or empire.Malcolm Collins: [00:00:00] What if we saw men and women begin to cluster within two parties instead of this urban rural divide being the primary differentiator between the parties? So here I'm going to put up a chart where you see you have a huge explosion of difference in, in South Korea, a smaller one in the United States, a, a larger one in Germany and a large one in the UK as well.

Would you like to know more?

Simone Collins: Hello, Malcolm. We are actually here not just to order Indian food because we're being indulgent and weak. Did you, did you probably see order yet? I did. It's, it's ordered. It's kind of,

Malcolm Collins: Okay, well we are here to discuss a political theory I have had for a while.

And it's weird because I actually. Like, I'm surprised we haven't seen this happen more. And now we're really beginning to see it play out in politics. And I don't like it's one of the theories where I was like, I'm surprised more people didn't have this theory or didn't think this was going to happen.

And Simone pointed out that during women's suffrage, actually, a lot of people did expect this to happen. [00:01:00] I just need to go back to those old articles before ideas like this were banned from the general population. So we need to set a few stages here. Okay. Men and women are psychologically different from each other.

They see the world different from each other on average, not every man and every woman, right. But on average, the necessary throat

Simone Collins: clearing complete,

Malcolm Collins: right. And if you look at, well, I mean, it's, it's, you know, and I, I mentioned this. I often get sad when I think about like Neanderthals going extinct, how cool would it be if like another type of human lived on this world that we could commune with.

And learn from and see the world differently from their perspective, because they'd almost certainly have like systemic psychological differences from us. And I'm like, but we do. And like, even better than that with this male, female thing, you get to like make out with them and you get to choose one as like your primary partner for life.

No, it works well. Right. But there are. [00:02:00] Sustained psychological differences between men and women, which people, I think, you know, the left doesn't want to, it doesn't want to talk about it, it doesn't want to admit it, because they have this belief that all humans are the same, all humans are exactly psychologically the same, all humans have exactly the same proficiencies, and yet somehow Diversity matters.

Diversity doesn't matter if we're not different. Diversity is a thing of value because we are different, you knobs. What you actually mean is you are incapable of dealing with a world in which genuine diversity exists. And this is something we see when leftists start shrieking when they're like, But if you genetically select your kids for IQ, what if your kids are smarter than the general population?

And it's like the world isn't hurt because some smarter people exist. Yeah. Is it, are we worse off for Einstein? Are we worse off for X smart person? Like there is. Well,

Simone Collins: and as a Johnny anomaly argues in the book, future humans I higher IQ is, is pretty [00:03:00] well documented to be associated with pro sociality, you know, plus, you know, a better economy, all these other good things.

So if you are an incredibly dumb person, you want to live where there are smart people, it doesn't matter.

Malcolm Collins: It doesn't, it doesn't, but, but the point being is it's an incredibly sociopathic thing to say and what they really mean by saying that is because the way that their party and their ideology has been able to justify and engage with diversity It's through pretending that diversity doesn't actually exist when a they recognize that through things like genetic selection, human diversity may come to exist.

They psychologically are incapable of dealing with that. And as such, their only action is to maintain human genetic purity and prevent people like us from breeding because they don't like that. pollute the human gene pool with science.

Simone Collins: I don't like our, our, my little pencil neck and our glasses. It's so funny when people like in articles that make fun of us [00:04:00] or in like chat threads that make, or whatever, like Reddit threads and make fun of us for being eugenicists, you know, they accused us of that, even though they're totally wrong.

Then they like proceed to be like, and they're, they're nearsighted. They wear. Thick glasses. Like,

Malcolm Collins: I'm sorry, a eugenics insult though, right? It shows they're the eugenics that they have. It really does inclination,

Simone Collins: isn't it? Yeah. This, it's not a, it's not a good look. Whereas like, if you're excited

Malcolm Collins: when anyone, you know, who wants to have kids and is, is socially responsible as having kids, right?

Yeah. Yeah. But anyway so. I had this theory where I was thinking where it's like, okay, so, and this is true, men and women vote differently, right? They have different views on subjects and they relate to political subjects in different ways that men and women would drift towards sort of their own political parties and that the primary political divide in the world would become a male female divide rather than a party or inclination [00:05:00] divide.

And so, you know, historically, if you look at the United States, what the political divide had been up until recently was an urban rural divide urban populations versus rural populations. And this makes a lot of sense. You know, the urban populations were the Democrats and the rural populations were the Republicans.

And as the Democrats became more of a monoculture, like as the city centers begin to be eaten by the mimetic virus, which is sort of eating the world. And the only place where you could have diversity anymore was within rural population centers. The, the, the Republicans became the party of diversity and the Democrats became the party of conformity.

Now of course they superficially need to pretend like they care about diversity because they want diversity of victims for the virus. They don't care what you look like or what your background is or what you're. Your moral fortitude is if they can convert you, they'll take you. And that's what they mean by diversity, but they, they don't actually tolerate any sort of diversity of ideologies or cultural perspectives.

Outside of in the most token of context [00:06:00] and I can go deep. Well, it's, it's

Simone Collins: it's extremely inclusive and also. conformist. It's inclusive and conformist.

Malcolm Collins: Yes. So, and that's what it means to have a diversity of victims. It's inclusive and conformist. They will take anyone, but once you join, you cannot ideological differ on any meaningful point.

You can't differ on what you think about human sexuality. You can't differ on what you think about gender. You can't differ on what you think about our relation to the environment. You can't differ on what you think about morality. You can't differ on what you think about the future birth species should be.

So there's just a really tight constraint on the cultural practices here. You can wear your lily. and, and say that you're from a culturally different, you can't even say that humans are different from each other. You can't differ on that point. God, no. Whereas you know, the, the diversity of rural cultures, they genuinely do have a diversity of belief systems.

But anyway, so I was like, well, What if we saw men and women begin to cluster within two parties instead of this urban rural divide being the primary differentiator between the parties? And [00:07:00] now I think that that's what we're seeing, and we're seeing it more and more these last few years. Why it's happened these last few years, I don't know, but I'm going to put a graph on the screen.

It appears to be tied directly to modern sort of potentially demographic collapse or the internet. And we can hypothesize as to what, or really the, the, a bit after the proliferation of mobile phones. So here I'm going to put up a chart where you see you have a huge explosion of difference in, in South Korea, a smaller one in the United States, a, a larger one in Germany and a large one in the UK as well.

So let's just talk about what we're seeing in these different graphs. So in South Korea, you see men going. Significantly more conservative starting around 2015 and then just exploding in the conservative direction. Yeah.

Simone Collins: So the, the, the young men in, in South Korea specifically prefer the conservative opposition people power party [00:08:00] and the young women of South Korea are polarizing into the liberal democratic party.

So it's also the same, it's conservative versus liberal in terms of mindset.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, well, well, and there's something that you see in most of these graphs as well, particularly in the U. S. graph, is that if you go to the 1980s, it was actually women who were more likely to be conservative and men who were more likely to be progressive.

Simone Collins: But isn't that when the conservative party was more conformist?

Malcolm Collins: Exactly. That's what you're really seeing here as a conformist versus anti conformist tendency. Whereas this is when the satanic panic was happening. This is when the conservative party was really controlled by panicky housewives who were afraid that their kids were listening to too much rock and roll.

And, and of course that appeals to the same conservative, whatever you sell, lower C conservative intuition that women have which is that they need to control what everyone else is thinking and doing. And, and so in the U. S., what you see, which is really interesting, is that after you have this switch in parties, [00:09:00] which happened in the eighties, men have actually stayed about the same in their political beliefs, whereas women have gone far, far, far to the left.

And, and this really started around 2010. So you're saying women

Simone Collins: are becoming more extreme, men are not. Men

Malcolm Collins: are not in the U. S. The same is

Simone Collins: true in Germany. Do you think the same is true in South, yeah, I guess in South Korea is where you're getting the four nose movement. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, no,

Malcolm Collins: no. The opposite happened in South Korea.

Yes, women are becoming slightly more extreme in South Korea, but it's really mostly men who are becoming more extreme in

Simone Collins: South Korea. In what way are men becoming more extreme in South Korea? Because most people just talk about the four nose movement, which is all, it's a women thing. It's not,

Malcolm Collins: it's like, well, I think that's why women don't want to marry these men anymore, because they all expect women to have these really conservative attitudes.

But yeah, no, men, it is men who have gone off the deep end in South Korea. Women have gone off the deep end in the U. S. In Germany, it's women who have gone off the deep end. And in the UK, a very interesting phenomenon happened that you might be surprised about. Men and women actually tracked with women being more conservative until around 2010.[00:10:00]

Whoa, so present. Then both men and women flew way more progressive. Whereas women just going further than men.

Simone Collins: Okay.

Malcolm Collins: So interesting, right? Like Uh, this, this is, this is not what I expected to see, but it does make sense. If you have like this two species world, basically men are for Mars, men are for species, Venus. That's the way you explain it to like a dumb person with me. I'm like men are Neanderthals, women are Homo sapiens, like, two different like biological perspectives on realities.

It makes sense when you, I think it's really the internet that causes when you have the internet and people are able to find common cause, especially. Actually, no, I'm going to take it back. It's not the internet that caused this. You know what I think caused this? Hmm? The breakdown of relationship structure.

I think what historically caused men and women to converge on a similar political [00:11:00] ideology is that most men and women were married. Oh, so that

Simone Collins: is to say that they aligned over something bigger than just themselves and therefore found common ground? Yeah,

Malcolm Collins: not only that, but you had these two different iterations of humanity, but they were always living in these partnerships with each other.

And so there was some motivation to learn how the other side thought and to learn the other side's value system and to be tempered by that other side. I mean, I think a lot of red pillars, they come to our podcast and they're like, wow, he looks so cut in the way he relates to ideas. And it's like, no, I just understand that there's value in multiple perspectives.

And my wife brings me value in helping me see a more holistic picture of the world.

Simone Collins: But I think we should also discuss why the progressive ideology has become so dominant when in the past a, a, you know, like masculine leadership has, has been dominant. And, and I think the, the problem is that now governing structures are bureaucratic in nature.

Like [00:12:00] that is just how governments work. That's how they're set up and women perform better in bureaucracies. Like that's my theory. At least you think that there's something else going on here? Like why, why is the female dominated party and why would conformism, which you'd think wouldn't be as competitive, you think it would lead to ossification and stagnation and, you know, losing a competitive edge.

Why, why?

Malcolm Collins: Ah, so this is interesting. And we had prepped about this this morning. Why is it the female side has become more dominant than the male side? So I think that there's sort of three overlapping factors here. I think probably the most important factor is not the female over competition was in bureaucratic environments, but that females are the sexual gatekeepers of our species and that a lot of men, when I see men who are progressives, they really appear to be largely pretending for access to sex.

That's like, not all, but especially the most progressive men, like the white 90 men they don't appear [00:13:00] to actually hold these views. It appears to be, what do I need to say and do to get access to women? And we have talked about this in our studies, whereas people point out, if you're looking at the amounts of grapes that are reported by women who are.

in progressive communities, like college campuses and stuff like that. They are higher than in, like, basically lawless Sub Saharan African countries. Like, the, the like, the amount of grapes you see in these communities seem almost impossibly high to people. They're like, these are higher than regions where people are earning On average, yearly less than 5, 000 USD per year.

Like, and, and where there is not a sustained police population, everything like that. How is that possible? And so they discount them. They say the women are over reporting these. I do not believe women are over reporting these. I believe from, from what I've seen, when women enter these communities that are extremely pro left I think that it disproportionately attacks [00:14:00] grapist men.

And I think it makes a lot of sense when you think about it. Like, if a man is just a complete sociopath, and if you do have this differentiation between the way men and women view the world, the men with integrity are going to say, even if it loses some access to sexual partners, what they really think, whereas the sociopaths and the narcissists are going to say whatever they need to say to gain access to sexual resources.

And so women in these communities are having much more unconsensual sex. Because of this, because they don't understand what they have done, where they have said we will not allow any man into our community who doesn't answer yes to these questions, but the only men answering yes to these questions are the ones who are lying.

And so they have basically created a shooting fish in a barrel situation. And it's, it's really horrifying. And, and this is something I'd be really scared about with my daughters is letting them go into these communities. Because I think that they are actually pretty likely to be graped within these communities.

It reminds me, I mean, and, and, and there is this delusion was in these [00:15:00] communities around the actual risk. I mean, if you remember when the Israeli Palestinian war broke out, a lot of these protests were predominantly female. Where they were protesting, like, let there be peace, let's promote the people of Gaza.

And they were all along the Gaza border, right? And there was, I think, at least one, I think there was more than one of these, these big, like, peace concerts where you had all of this horrible stuff happen. But it, but You're like, why would they go there? Like, why would they think this is a good idea?

And it is because there is this, like, delusion field and conformity enforcement within this female side of things. There is much less desire to seek what is true and much more desire for conformity. Regardless if, if this is true or that is true. And then it leads to higher amounts of these, these negative things happening within these communities.

So I think that that's one thing, right, is sexual access and they're able to use sexual access to pull out all the sociopathic men and all the narcissistic men. And just, you know, like, this is generally what I think when I see a man who is [00:16:00] a far progressive, I generally think he must be a sociopath or a narcissist.

Some level of like dark pride personality traits there. Then the other thing that you see is this higher performance within bureaucratic organizations. I think that's another thing that leads to it. And the final thing is that I think that before this, the parties really were genuinely divided into an urban optimization function and a rural optimization function.

For the different economic sectors within our country. I mean, historically, whenever you've had two different economic sectors in the country, that's where the parties have sort of. Coagulated. And the urban the previous urban faction, of course, is going to have more power than the rural faction.

And of course, it's going to be more conformist than the rural faction because an individual who isn't conformist is going to leave urban population centers. Do you have additional thoughts on this or I remember you had some really piffy thing that you said this morning. . I was incredibly impressed. I was like, Oh, what a, what a fun thing to say. Yeah, I see my notes from this morning's conversation, but I [00:17:00] don't see I'm sorry. Oh, well, you are always so entertaining when we're having these. Pre whatever talks and now our audience doesn't get to hear your brilliance.

Simone Collins: I love that, that you, you still provide this plausible deniability that I may actually sometimes have good ideas when like, really, honestly, let's be honest, most of my ideas are actually no, no, all of the fun.

I just

Malcolm Collins: convinced I bounced my ideas off of you and you helped me come to them, but I wouldn't come to them without you

Simone Collins: asking dumb questions. It's a very pinky in the brain kind of thing. Which is perfect.

Malcolm Collins: It's a good time, but I think many more people think I'm insane than you.

Simone Collins: I mean, the brain is kind of insane.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, I guess. Right.

Simone Collins: Pinky's just dumb. So everyone wins, you know,

Malcolm Collins: I love you.

What are we gonna do tomorrow night? The same thing we do every night, Pinky. Try to take over the world!

Malcolm Collins: Okay. Well, would you have any additional thoughts on this? Like, why do you think women have been able to achieve so much more power within this existing political system?

Simone Collins: I think it's 100%. I mean, so we are going through the [00:18:00] process right now.

Like one of the reasons why I cannot think is because we are going through the process of attempting to collect a sufficient number of petition signatures to get on the Republican ballot to run for State House in Pennsylvania. And the process is so incredibly. Bureaucratic, all these little, then like the paper in this, well, this has to be printed double sided with both sides up and you can't like not on this.

You can never put this and you have to put the township and not the city name. And he, Oh my God, like this is insane. And like, this is not, this is not, I think

Malcolm Collins: you need to have a level of submissiveness that was in you and inherent to you to be open to doing this. Well,

Simone Collins: and, and just sort of like bureaucratic pompousness and like, Well, a lack of ambition, frankly, because like to, yeah, to submit yourself to a system that is so dumb, that is so inefficient, that is so poorly designed.

And I get, I get the intent behind a lot of the things that are [00:19:00] built into the. process of registering a campaign committee and, you know, becoming, you know, a candidate to run for office and collecting signatures. I understand the intent, but oh my God, they did it so bad. So like, yeah, to, to be, I would say like that typical, like hyper masculine high risk high reward kind of archetype and to run for office is very, very difficult, or especially to be a government worker and like live in that world every single day.

You know, at least politicians Sort of have to go through a lot of bureaucratic nonsense. And then I guess then they never really escape it, but then they become capable of hiring people to do a lot of it for them. You know what I mean? And then they become more of like a figurehead, at least like higher up in the system.

Yeah. But yeah, I mean, to me, that's, I just, I can't, I can't avoid seeing that as just such, such a major factor. And again, it's about conformity. It's, you have to go through this exact process, and if you deviate it, if one little part of the form is not properly filled out, you are out. That is conformity.

You know, [00:20:00] that is, that is imposing conformity on a group, saying that you are, you know, equally You know, you are open to all, and this is a process, it's entirely democratic, except, well, actually, I mean, if you have a job, or Yeah,

Malcolm Collins: you keep saying, if you have a job, there's no way you could run for office in this

Simone Collins: country.

There's no way. I don't get it. Yeah, I mean, like, if you're collecting

Malcolm Collins: amputation signatures If you're an economically productive citizen, and economically productive, people don't understand this about economics. They're like, well, that just means you make more money. You know, the amount of money you make is generally correlated with the amount you add to society.

And then people are like, well, what about billionaires? Like they make so much money and I'm like, well, it reminds me of this you know, you love these 1950s Coronet films. I think one did a very good job of showing this. It was like every individual factory worker is able to make, well, you know, X boppits per day and that's how much money.

And then it's like, But then Joe came along and learned you could add this and it like increase every factory workers productivity by [00:21:00] 25%. He's like, that's the equivalent of like X many, because there's like X many thousand factory workers. That's the equivalent of X many, you know, thousand a day. And, and he's like, and that's why Joe deserves to be paid more than like.

500 factory workers and of course, we'll be like, what? It's like, no, that is literally the incremental benefit he provided to society. And they're like, well then what about the, the investors? Like certainly they don't deserve this. Well, if this guy who just did this, then takes his money. And risks it and puts us on the line.

We do investing. We lose our money investing all the time. Like, I think people act like investing is like a sure thing, right? Like, we lose our money investing all the time. Probably, well, until now, we've probably made slightly more money investing than we've lost in terms of high risk deals. But even still, like, You, you, you, if you are not incredibly smart and incredibly judicious and put in an incredible amount of work into betting these investments and these investments allow [00:22:00] other people, people without capital, people without, you know, for example, and they're like, Oh, yeah, well, you're just giving it to like Harvard grads or something like that.

And it's like, well, actually, If you give money to Harvard grads, you're going to make significantly less money off of those investments. The investments where we make the most money are the money where people don't want to give that individual money because there's something about them. Like in Korea, we would often invest in people who dropped out of college.

In the U. S., we invest in people who have been in the prison system. Because nobody else wants to give them money so we can get better terms. And they're like, isn't that like using them? No! Like, this is why capitalism is good! Because they're offering us better terms, somebody who otherwise wouldn't have looked at them now thinks that this is a potentially interesting investment, and we can all benefit!

It's a very beautiful system, to be honest. But of course, to a conformist who wants to do nothing, you know, one of the posts I saw this morning that really got me is, it was like They were mad that women were not just like standing in front of watering holes. They're like, I was as a [00:23:00] woman meant to just like, stand around and look beautiful all day in front of like, like water nymphs, like, like around pools of water.

Right? Women

Simone Collins: never did that. Like even women who like were paid for their looks, they have to work their asses off. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And still, you know, like the biggest earners on OnlyFans and all these other sites are those who work hard. Oh

Malcolm Collins: my God. That's what we respect about Ayla. She puts all this effort into, like, all this stuff around sex statistics.

If you look at her early story, she was doing all the statistical research to find out how to make her accounts do well in the early days. Because, I mean, at least to me, I don't know, other people may think she's particularly attractive. I don't. I think she's gorgeous. I don't think she's as attractive as you.

Simone Collins: Are you kidding? No, she is way more attractive than me, but I guess I'm your type, thank god. Oh my god, I'm so glad I'm your type. But, so, here's a question that I have. Is, okay, Outlook not good. [00:24:00] You know, South Korea is. Especially because they sort of have no other Cultural differentiation that's really distinct.

It's now gone to gender and the parties are becoming incredibly polarized. And our party system is becoming quite polarized among youth as well. You know, this is not looking good. What, how, in what future timeline? What would the future timeline look like in which this is not? This, this gets better. How will,

Malcolm Collins: how will it get better?

You need to move to charter cities and charter cities are the future of the political and economic structure of the world.

Simone Collins: I was thinking something smaller, but different. I was thinking like fiefdoms that eventually that's what a

Malcolm Collins: charter city is

Simone Collins: to me, sound too bureaucratic to actually be, I'm sorry to charter cities, but like the existing

Malcolm Collins: charter cities will create a good one.

Yeah. Well, but

Simone Collins: then it's, it's really a fiefdom. Like it is. So it's like basically like a ruler or a business that creates some sovereign territory that people move to because it's [00:25:00] actually functioning. And I, I just don't, I, so my, here's my problem with charter cities and maybe this is totally wrong.

And I'd love for you to school me. And where I'm just not that convinced is people who create a city just to create a city. Okay. Are not going to create a good city. Good cities come from economic, economic opportunity. They come from people who are already. Like wealthier producing or

Malcolm Collins: because you're thinking in a historic context.

Yeah. And that is true in a historic context, but the world has changed in a world with rapidly declining populations in the economically productive countries and population pools. Historically, when you had a ever increasing world talent pool. Things of a discreet quantity increased in value on average, whether it's gold or land or Bitcoin when you have a, a rapidly decreasing quantity of individuals who are economically productive, it is the individuals [00:26:00] themselves who become the primary units of account within a society.

And so as far as those individuals are mobile, they will leave the countries they're in and move to these charter cities which makes these charter cities, the primary, because countries like the U S will become increasingly taken over by these feminist socialist dictatorships basically, unless they go in the opposite direction.

And we have a break from our democratic system right now. And, and so, as they become more and more bureaucratic, more and more toxic to live in for anyone who's economically productive or innovative those individuals will leave and go to these small concentrated areas, which will be the economic hubs of the world in the future.

Do you

Simone Collins: think these, these male polarized parties, you know, the conservative party in the U S the people power party in, in South Korea, are they. doomed to fail? Is there some world in which masculinity in government can succeed?[00:27:00]

Malcolm Collins: There is, but it requires a political and social system shift where we are moving from the period of the Roman Republic to the Roman Empire. Oh no!

Simone Collins: And I think we're not implying that Trump should become an emperor, by the way.

Malcolm Collins: No, I, I do not think he'd be a particularly effective emperor. Well, he's

Simone Collins: too old.

I think you need a younger emperor. Like, if we're going to go that way. I am

Malcolm Collins: implying I should become an emperor.

Simone Collins: Please, Malcolm. I'm all for this. I'm

Malcolm Collins: I'd, I'd find a way to do it. Trust me, bloodlessly. But,

Simone Collins: yeah, you vaporize them instead of other messy mechanisms, I'm all for that. Right,

Malcolm Collins: no but I, I do think that that's realistically where we're going as a country.

We're either going to transition from a democracy to an empire or we are going Do you think that's possible

Simone Collins: in the United States? I just don't know. I, I don't Are you serious? I think the United States is too well resourced

Malcolm Collins: Hold on, hold on, let's talk about how possible it is. Both political parties in the U.

S. right now are genuinely unwilling to recognize the [00:28:00] legitimate election of the opposite party. But

Simone Collins: hasn't that been happening throughout our entire lifetimes? It

Malcolm Collins: has not. People who tell you that are lying to you.

Simone Collins: I remember what a big deal it was when George Bush beat Gore. Allegedly.

Malcolm Collins: Yes, but people largely admitted that that was okay and moved on with it.

I think right now, no, no, no, it's true, if you look historically in American history, there have been periods of higher political divide, where people hated each other more, where people said worse things about the other candidate, right? But people still basically believe the democratic system was working.

When you saw the first Trump election cycle, right? There was genuine disbelief on the left that he had actually been elected. And now they are moving to a system and it's worse than that. Okay. It's worse than just a, a, a, a disbelief in the system. In the left and you see this within leftist communities today where I'm like, [00:29:00] look, there is actually pretty good evidence of not election fraud in the way that Republicans talk about election fraud.

But yeah, there was stuff going on. I, I can't get too into detail here because this is one of those things where we have special access to information that other people don't have access to. And when I talk about this with my other, you know, quote unquote, not other, but like elitist leftist friends who I have who consider us part of their peer group, they're like, yeah, but like.

It's okay because Trump can't be elected.

Simone Collins: It's okay because we want it.

Malcolm Collins: No, but historically that wasn't the way Americans felt. Americans didn't feel that it was genuinely a danger to allow someone who they disagreed with to be democratically elected. And the left feels this way very, very strongly.

Now they genuinely feel. That if the alternative is Trump, cheating is better, but the right also [00:30:00] feels this way. If the alternative is the left, cheating is better. And I hear this among my Republican friends as well. I am sorry. I hear this. They're like, this is better. It's not everyone. It's not everyone on the left.

It's not everyone on the right. But the proportion of Americans who feel this way. As people who interact with both the left and the right, both people in high positions within the left and the right this mindset is becoming increasingly common. And you can say that, oh, you guys are evil for saying that we are transitioning to an empire.

I'm not even saying this is a prescriptive thing. I'm just saying it is obviously happening. When both parties begin to think it's Okay to cheat in elections and begin to deny the election results when they do not turn out in their favor, which both parties are doing increasingly now that is the premonitions or our predecessors to an imperial turning.

Or a collapse, or one party basically banning the other party, or, oh, you know what they would do, I mean, [00:31:00] classically, like, suppose we were in some communist dictatorship, right, right, where, like, the two party system was basically a scam, what they would do is they would just send the, the leading candidate of the opposing party to jail.

You know, tie them up with a bunch of criminal proceedings, but that would never happen in the

Simone Collins: U. S. No! And that's, no, certainly, that couldn't happen, it certainly hasn't recently happened multiple times, I mean, come on, Malcolm.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, I, I would never accuse the U. S. of doing something as insane as having, Spurious lawsuits against a political opponent.

And people are like, no, no, no, the lawsuits aren't spurious. You see, it says right here on the lawsuits that the lawsuits exist for this reason. And every one of my political party agrees with me that this is a good reason to have this lawsuit. And it's like, I'm like, I like Trump. Okay, but I'm not like the biggest fan.

I think he's got some ethical issues. These lawsuits are completely spurious. They are [00:32:00] just meant for political advantage. Well, the one's taking

Simone Collins: him off the ballot because he hasn't been convicted of committing treasonous acts. He hasn't been convicted of inciting an insurrection. There's been no conviction.

Malcolm Collins: And they're like, oh, oh, but technically you don't need a conviction. It's like, okay, if you're saying, well, technically I'm allowed to do this when it's taking the leading political opposition off a ballot, you need to understand that you are setting Our system up for a transfer, whether it's your side or ours to an imperial system, because when you think that you could do something that severe to a democratic system out of a technicality due to wording, you are showing how little respect you have for the will of the people of this country.

It's pretty bad. No side has respect for the will of the people, then why are we even pretending anymore?

Simone Collins: I don't know though, I mean like when, when we've done [00:33:00] doorknocking, for example, you know, we have people saying things like, I just want nothing to do with politics. I'm also seeing like an increasing indifference.

And I wonder if a lot of what's going on because I don't, like, you know, polling can be really off. Is if similar with like you get the impression that like every college student that isn't openly conservative is pro Hamas when like really not really, you know, that's, that's not the case. And you get the impression that like America is very polarized on the issue of abortion when no,

Malcolm Collins: everyone's like, Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. on some of the stuff. Really? Okay. I think you might be underestimating the extent of the virus within the college ecosystem. In the amount of, but maybe you're

Simone Collins: overestimating the way that the college ecosystem represents mainstream. society, most Americans. No, no,

Malcolm Collins: they do not understand what they mean when they say I am pro Hamas.

They do not understand what they mean when they say I am suspicious of the intentions of the Israeli state, but they still feel these things because they [00:34:00] do not think for themselves. I think that this is actually a mainstream opinion on college campuses. I think antisemitism is actually mainstream in the U S right now.

And, and I think it's been mainstream in the left for a while. When I went to college, my college did research with the, I went to St Andrews and they did research for the Israeli military. Like we did collaborations with them. This was in the UK. And at one point during my college experience students did like a sit down and like one of the major college buildings and like, didn't allow classes to happen.

They didn't let anything to happen. And it was to cancel these research partnerships that we were doing with Israel. It didn't end up happening. Back, back then the university still had a spine. They were just like, what? But no, this stuff has happened historically for a long time. And I'd actually say for like the reformed Jewish movement, who was like, this came out of nowhere.

This reminds me of like, you know, because I've talked to a lot of people who lived through the Holocaust and they're like, look, I read Mein Kampf. Like I knew this was coming. This reminds me of a [00:35:00] lot of people from that time where they're like, I told my community, read this dang book. He's telling us what he's about to do.

You guys need to get the out. And

Simone Collins: I feel that right now both sides have, okay, so your argument is that both sides have a very clear playbook and each playbook is extremely anti democratic.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah, both playbooks are anti democratic, but I'd also, specifically what you're hearing here is the progressive side is incredibly anti semitic.

And anyone who cannot see what happens if they win, any Jew who can't see what happens if they win, is, honestly, they deserve what they get. And people might be like, why would you say that? And it's because well, this experience that I had, that was really meaningful to me. So I was talking was I might've talked about this in some of our books, but it was my girlfriend in high school.

I dated a Jewish girl for a while, really liked her actually. She's one of my favorite girlfriends I dated other than my wife. Right. Why do I always date Jews? Right. I always date Jews. Anyway. And her grandfather. I've only heard of one. Anyway.

Simone Collins: And I, I.

Malcolm Collins: Yeah. So her [00:36:00] grandfather escaped the Holocaust and he was in a Jewish community at the time and he had actually read Mein Kampf and that's what him off.

And he got really freaked out. He's like, this is going to happen. And he was a teenager at the time. And he got like he made such a stink about this. Like apparently he like made a big about this to try to get everyone's attention. And, and the community basically kicked him out. And so what He, he broke into his girlfriend at the time's house like broke in, like broke the window, snuck in at night and was like, look, either you come with me or you're definitely going to die.

And she trusted him and she came with him and he ended up marrying her and that was his wife and this, this girl was a descendant of this family and everyone he knew for, he knew from that community ended up dying. And, and I think that when you're saying something, when you're like, look, you don't understand, the powers that be are actually threatening to you right now.

No, I would say with this story, it does not have the happiest he did make a few mistakes. Specifically, he [00:37:00] fled to Poland. Whoops. And then he fled to Russia. Oh. And then he fled to Siberia.

He ended up coming to the US. From the East. That was how bad it ended up having to be.

Simone Collins: Oh, so he, just like Dante, he just had to go all the way through hell.

Malcolm Collins: All the way through hell to come back out. And settled on the East Coast and had a bunch of descendants. And lived at, and he was very financially successful in life. So, he lived a happy, you know, whatever life. But I think that people don't like, like one of the useful things about studying what was happening and what happened to the Jews who tried to warn their communities about what was about to happen pre Holocaust is you can learn a lot from that.

Like that got me really interested in this phenomenon. What happened to the Jews who tried to warn their communities what was about to happen? And I think that today. Within Jews in the progressive sphere who are warning, like, this is not normal, what's going on right now. [00:38:00] Bad things are going to come of this.

And worse, things that are so bad that it would be considered offensive for me to even tell you where this is heading. Yeah. I mean, people

Simone Collins: felt in the past. What makes me very concerned about this is when the pandemic. There was just this complete inability of even really, really, really smart people we know, although a lot of people that I would, I think so, so many of your smart friend circles did totally see this coming and were like, guys, everyone, let's get PPE like in January, you know, like

Malcolm Collins: all my friends are doing

Simone Collins: this.

So many other smart people we knew like many of, of the investors in our travel business, for example, were like, don't worry, this will blow over in four months, like, it's fine. Yeah, people

Malcolm Collins: need to understand with the pandemic, we shut down our company and battered basically all the doors at a stage where if the pandemic happened [00:39:00] the way we predicted, because I was like looking at pandemic cases, I have a background training in biology.

I was like, there is no way this doesn't spread globally. I do not know how anyone is saying this isn't going to spread globally. The pandemic was real. Like conservatives are like the pandemic isn't real. The pandemic was real. People did stuff in response to it, but the pandemic was real. When I was like, they're definitely going to shut down and ground all flights.

If we had been wrong in this assertion, we would have been fired and we would have been permanently disgraced in our fields. We bet our careers, our lives and our livelihoods on the pandemic spreading in the way that it did. And we were told that we were insane by otherwise smart people. Because at the time, the progressive standpoint was, and a lot of people forget that this was true early in the pandemic, because it was anti the narrative, the people freaking out about the pandemic were called conservative extremists in the very early days.

Simone Collins: And that's just, it makes me afraid because it [00:40:00] means, what are we going to experience with other, like, black swan,

Malcolm Collins: We're experiencing a few right now. I mean, that's what the fertility crash, blah,

Simone Collins: yeah, right. And people are completely unwilling to recognize that it could possibly be an issue, right? So,

Malcolm Collins: Well, I love you and I'm glad that you have so much mental fortitude and that you're here fighting with me for all this because The world would be screwed if it wasn't for women like you.

And I really hope that our audience who's out there looking for partners can find good partners. Good women exist. Like men who are,

Simone Collins: Oh, hold on. And you just cut out after saying good women

Malcolm Collins: exist. Good women exist. Men who are out there saying you can't trust any woman. All I'd say is that you are objectively and provably wrong.

There are many men who have had great relationships with intelligent, emotionally mature women. And really, this is just your [00:41:00] defeatism. If you can make yourself into a good enough man, you can get a great woman. You just have to keep trying and you need to treat it like a second job. Yeah, but wise words.

Malcolm videos on finding a wife in a fallen world. That's one of our, are actually better performing videos. So if anyone wants to check that out, Oh,

Simone Collins: that's good. I'm glad. Cause I really want people to, you know, we had

Malcolm Collins: the paired video on that, which is how to get sex whenever you want sex. And, and the AI said, Oh no, no, no, no, no, no, no.

We do not like your strategy. We do not

Simone Collins: publish this. We do not publish this. Maybe someday. There will be some like high tier of sub stack subscriber that gets access to that, but

Malcolm Collins: also like, no, because then reporters would pay for access to it and they'd use it against us. Yeah.

Simone Collins: Not, Oh, like our political careers and public advocate careers are not already completely destroyed

Malcolm Collins: by which I am debating whether or not to publish now, which is it is victim blaming actually a good thing.

Simone Collins: Exactly. So that's, I mean, you know, we're done. It includes

Malcolm Collins: [00:42:00] the argument not the argument. The question from the evidence is, is it more the husband or the wife's fault when the wife gets abused? Physically abused. This is a very spicy question to consider seriously.

And so,

So we don't consider it seriously, we consider it as a joke, and we look only at fictional data, not real world data. I mean, if it accidentally correlates with real world data, that would be a funny, weird thing. But we certainly hadn't looked at the data before.

postulating what it might say.

Simone Collins: Certainly not. Then, you know, of course, regardless, we're going to hell. So, I'll see you in hell, my friend. But

Malcolm Collins: Obviously, we're going to progressive hell, which it turns out, weird is heaven. That, that telling the truth, even when it conflicts with the societal narratives That it turns out that isn't what gets people actually sent to hell.

It's lying so that you can fit societal narratives and be accepted [00:43:00] within a population group that has fallen that that's what gets you sent to hell in the real world. But anyway, so fun.

Simone Collins: Hell is wherever you aren't, so as long as we're going together, my friend, we're good.

Malcolm Collins: You are the sweetest, best wife I could ask for.

Simone Collins: I, I hate all humans except you. I don't know what to say. And our kids, of course, but that's just pocket Malcolms. I love all the pocket Malcolms.

Malcolm Collins: I need to add the little quote by April Lovegate here, ,

I guess I kind of hate most things, but I never really seemed to hate you. So I want to spend the rest of my life with you. Is that cool?

Simone Collins: Beautiful quote. Beautiful quote. Well, we got some Indian food to get.

I'm so excited. Thank you, Malcolm.

Malcolm Collins: Thank you.

Simone Collins: It worked? I think it did. Whoa. Cool. [00:44:00] All right.

Malcolm Collins: Well. I appreciate you changing your order for my benefit. Oh,

Simone Collins: you know, I only, I just really want to make you a happy, like it matters so f*****g much to me.

 Oh my god. It's happening. F**k, it's happening. Jesus, I'm so excited.

Malcolm Collins: You need to stop being so excited. Why did you do this? Because I want you to be happy. And I thought that this would really cheer you up tonight.

Simone Collins: Well How long have we been recording for seven minutes?

Malcolm Collins: I'll use some of this. Don't.

Simone Collins: Oh my God. You're the worst. Well, okay.